SomewhereonNeptune

On 9/13/2025 at 3:51 PM, hntnhole said:

At first read, I shuddered .... I haven't ever used Nextdoor, and I did notice your proverbial tongue-in-cheek, so I'm hoping for the best on your behalf.  

Thanks. I won't turn this into a political stump speech, but we had to really hold tight reins on discussion of the assassination since it was ripe for deep and nasty political debate and even some distasteful memes. Or explaining to people who obviously do not care to read why the guidelines prohibit national politics discussion in General feeds to the replies of every Karen in a 10 mile radius "asking for the manager". We tell them to go enjoy TikTok with the other crazies. 

If you don't have the experience of living in an HOA or needing to find a plumber or electrician (or losing/finding a pet before the Chinese takeout does), you're missing nothing on Nextdoor.  Though maybe your looky-lous are talking about your sling over there. 🤣

On 9/13/2025 at 9:29 AM, verbalBTTM said:

Most boys, especially twinks who hook up with much older men, do it for a few reasons, and it's usually not for the leathery signs of aging on a man.

 

1. Free drugs and dick

2. They're sugar babies

3. Have a daddy fetish

4. Prefer staying at a beach house for the weekend

 

I hope that answers your question.

Surprisingly, I lack the leathery signs of aging, just boyish good looks, great skin, and knock-on-wood a face that doesn't look a day over 39 despite being shaved bald. 😉

Yes, I've encountered #1 and #2 above, and that doesn't go far at all. I'm kinda red pilled against paying for sex in one way or another. As for #4, I'm 20 minutes drive from one of the best beaches in the US without having to be on it, so no one's had any designs on that one (though the private pool has garnered interest).

But I've encountered #3 more organically on some other sites where I get the whole daddy fetish or "I'm turned on by older guys". The conversations where the other party isn't of consenting age end abruptly since I don't crave a guest appearance with Chris Hansen. 🤣 I live in Florida not far from 'America's Favorite Sheriff' Grady Judd, so a news conference with my picture doesn't thrill me either.

It sounds like your adventures or situation taught you a lot and were positive. Happy for you. Like I said earlier, I don't want to be the reason some dude's life gets totally messed up or goes into therapy to overcome it. I can see and appreciate the other views down to a certain point, but I suppose any interest I may have in someone younger would be mentoring or protective in nature. And as others have far broader experience than me, the chances of that are negligible.

8 hours ago, hntnhole said:

The moderators don't do stuff like that.  They're mostly referees, controlling what can be posted, what can't, and they're here for our protection; not theirs.  This site (or any other, for that matter) could turn into one big fat mess without the guidelines being explained and enforced.  

Would you mind coming over on Nextdoor and reinforcing that to the Karens who think the Guidelines shouldn't apply to them? The past two days (we can all imagine why) have made the LGBT Politics threads here look downright meek.

Some of the things that get said from behind a keyboard on a literally hyper-local (read: down the same block in the same subdivision) neighborhood-focused network make you think they have the intelligence of a baseball score. Especially in a state with Constitutional Carry laws. 
____________________________
Yes you have First Amendment rights. Keep in mind that everyone also has Second Amendment rights.

14 hours ago, verbalBTTM said:

You've really captured how age provides us with wisdom from life experiences. At one point, we didn't appreciate the reasoning behind the limitations in age of consent laws. 

I suppose that as hot as it may seem that someone young and hot is into us, I don't want to be a predator in the situation. Like am I the "dirty old [banned word]" that's into little boys (answer in that case is an obvious "yes"), but I'd always wonder what he'd see in me, or if the roles were reversed, would I see a dude my age now being an instant "ick". Not a dad/son experience but a grand-dad/grandson experience.

And your point about being a mentor is more how I'd approach it. Someone older as a protector and to provide guidance in the right setting, but the other party would need to request that so I didn't feel like it was predation.

10 hours ago, ellentonboy said:

I'll stick with 18, even that age makes me question my decision.  I am not really comfortable having sex with someone who could be my son, but I have had sex with plenty of guys in their 20s who were hot and experienced.

I still think guys 30 to 55 are optimal.  They are experienced, and they usually know what they want and how to go about doing it.  Of course, there are exceptions, but I would take an experienced 40 year old guy any day over a 20 year old who doesn't know what the hell he is doing.  That's just my view .....

The "young enough to be my son" thing isn't that big of an issue at my age. That would make the guy somewhere between say 25 and 40. But the topic made me do soul-searching a bit to where I'd need to ask the following:

• For those who actually had an "early experience", how did you feel about it? Did it form how you are today? Did you or the older person take the initiative?

I'm hoping this doesn't run afoul of the guidelines. Not asking the details of the encounters or anything titillating, but how do you look back on it now? Might be interesting to hear those who responded with say sub-16 responses for proposed consenting age.

Uh oh...here comes Neptune saying something controversial or prone to be downvoted. (Ahem)

Now this is a really good question. Years ago, I probably would have said 16. That was around the time of my first experience and the consenting age in my state. But by the same token, that also had the capacity to mess with my brain, my emotions, and my feelings, and at 16 the idea of sex versus love are still formative. 

11 hours ago, verbalBTTM said:

Once a young person, as in our case, reaches the age of maturity (18), they are better equipped to understand the consequences of their decisions. While we all develop at different rates, by 18, most have experienced enough of life to form a general understanding and are expected to take responsibility for their choices. Before this age, individuals are rightly viewed as children, as they lack the life experience to fully grasp the repercussions of their actions.

This. Plus, growing up I'd routinely watch a priest sit in his van at a park that was known for being a pedo cruising spot. And he had predilections for 13 and 14 year olds. Know any 13 year olds able to process the full impact and notions of sex? Didn't think so, though quite a few of us had those experiences and most of us survived intact.

Entering my seventh decade, rarely would I suggest 16 or younger. Unless this was something that truly came out of the thoughts and actions of the younger party doing so of free will. But even that is sketchy to me because (and this will be controversial but it needs to be said) we have kids who are not yet maturationally developed at 13 or even younger being supported through gender transition and sexual reassignment. Breasts or penis, something's being altered at an age where they are possibly not able to process the future ramifications of their decision. 

Yeah, maybe some folks have had gender dysphoria, and I have cousins and nephews who are going through it, but pulling hormone blockers or chemical castration or mastectomies at ages below 16 is...is...well, crazy. I've spoken to detransitioners who went through procedures before 18 who not only now regret it but are trying to return to their genetic state, which adds more complexities. And I'm not prudish about these things, but my heart breaks for them.

Leave it the way it is, or move it to 18 where it isn't. Let kids enjoy being kids before they do something that will put them in therapy for several years. 

I can only echo the absolute dated feel of BBRT. No one has done frame navigation since the late 90's, and there's a reason for that. We have better development tools but apparently BBRT won't spring for a site update that uses them. And while people knock on BBRT for 'Oinks', Adam4Adam is even worse in many cases with its 'Winks' (I know, here's SoN complaining about A4A again, will he ever give it up?). I can count at least 5 or 6 winks per day from non-pic/limited-effort profiles or those who have descriptions that make it seem like the Gay eHarmony. I've stopped responding.

I concur with @ellentonboy on NKP. It's either more fetish based or more focused on 'pigs' and 'parTyinG'. They do seem lacking with their Groups implementation, so if you see a Group don't get too excited. There are only a few Poz Groups over there, most are blue ballers from what I gather.

I wonder how BZ would do if it enhanced their current search capacity to be more friendly to people trying to meet. Forums are great and an organic way to foster friendships or hookups, but there's already some search capacity here that could be leveraged for hooking up. Seems like there's a missed opportunity.

5 hours ago, hntnhole said:

Apparently it did.  

In my book, it remains the case that when I catch a bug, I won't go out breeding holes all night until it's over with.  That happens occasionally, and at least my conscience is clear.  I wouldn't knowingly share an std with anyone either.  

You and I agree on that. Others can do what they want, but I'd hope we're all better than that. Fact remains though that we need to operate under the premise that not everyone is as honest or above board about sexual health. 

I was feeling old having recently turned 60, but this thread just brightened my day. Good to know some folks still appreciate older guys. Thanks.

6 hours ago, tr4veler said:

thanks, @SomewhereonNeptune. I agree that attacking someone for posing an earnest question is silly and toxic. I personally practice consistent use of PrEP, testing every 3 months, and abstaining during treatment. After this latest bout of chlamydia, I think I will start using Doxy PEP too. The question was meant as a discussion point since I was musing about the fact that rectal chlamydia is a) extremely common; b) typically without symptoms; and c) easily treated. I wasn't planning on changing my behavior, but apparently this even asking about it makes me a bad person, so oh well 🤷‍♂️

There's always going to be a keyboard warrior no matter where you go. In a way, it's hypocritical of people to criticize any opinion stated about sex with STIs, but we also have discussed the ethics of 'stealthing' on these boards and I've seen people talking about the practice of it (in reality and fictionally) wax poetic about how 'hot' it is. We've read similar comments about non-consensual play. Point is that we should be able to talk about it even though the likelihood is that we'd find it repugnant in reality. Fantasy though...

3 hours ago, phillygwm said:

Who are we kidding?  We can all clutch our pearls but there have always been Typhoid Marys since before, well, Typhoid Mary.  People of a Certain Age (like me) have heard the stories of people who knowingly transmitted HIV, back when it was still a death sentence.  Even though YOU are not going out with Chlamydia etc., we can safely assume that some people are.   Everything in life is a calculated risk.

Anyone going out and having bareback encounters is likely doing so understanding the risks they take in doing so. You should expect that if you aren't asking questions, you're assuming the inherent risks. I and others are only happy to go in bare in a don't ask/don't tell context and already assume that I could get something nasty, or for that matter so can he. Sometimes that risk can be erotic in the right context. But I don't think that either @tr4veler or I will knowingly go out and knock someone with something they can't clear with a regimen of medication. Am I clutching my pearls about that? 

3 hours ago, anonCUMtainer said:

...I feel and consider that I am being generous and I am helping my fellow man. AND for me - that means the moral or ethic is NOT to even consider passing on any STI - I feel like I have the responsibility to interrupt the cycle and protect my fellow horny man as much as possible (and to help avoid getting it back).

I have LOST good fucks because they caught something from me...It's the ugly side of bareback. So PLEASE get tested, know your status, treat infections, be informed, and don't spread anything knowingly please men. I beg of you.

Presuming I even crossed paths a second time with someone and found out I'd passed along something untreated, I'd be mortified about it. Unless it was something consensual and neither of us were concerned or we accepted that as a by-product of our mutual preference for barebacking. But even that would involve a conversation and I gather that point got lost in how some folks might have viewed the OP's post.

On 9/1/2025 at 6:35 AM, BarebackedBear said:

The ethics are simple and shouldn't even be a question: you should make every effort to always know your status through regular testing, and disclose it to any potential partners so they can make an informed choice. Did you consider that it was someone either not knowing their status or actively hiding it from you that put you in this situation? Why would you risk doing the same to someone else?

If abstaining for a week so you can get treatment & protect your potential partners is too much for you, I'd consider doing some soul searching during your week of abstinence, because that's a next level of selfishness.

The last I checked, this is still a "discussion forum", except that in some parts here I find it gets rather preachy or holier-than-thou about having specific viewpoints. I certainly don't expect everyone to (or sometimes anyone) to agree with me, but I'd hope we be tolerant of other points of view regardless of finding them offensive. 

16 hours ago, tr4veler said:

Ok first of all, I am abstaining. I was as a default.  I asked what I thought was an interesting question here, and saw what the consensus was. It confirmed my baseline belief and I continued with it. 

second, I really don’t appreciate you coming into a message board where I asked a question and having you (who do not know me) calling me the “next level of selfishness.” Maybe you should do some “soul searching” about why you feel the need to come online and judge strangers like that. 

Thank you @tr4veler for calling this out. I'll weigh in and say this is a 'choice', but one that should be made with the benefit of information so that people are free to make decisions based on facts. Guess it's now a rarity to even talk about some subjects, and this is a place where I would think there are few or no sacred cows. 

I was (ahem...consenting age in my state), he was (almost) 18. As you might expect, it was a lot of clumsy fumbling since he was a huge premature ejaculator, and he wasn't at all big (about little finger size, that's being generous). He barely got in and was done in about 10 seconds. We flipped and it worked better with him bottoming.

It was memorable in that it was so off-the-chart bad. Spoke with others who knew him that spilled the tea, and suffice to say their experiences were equally tragic. Also heard he was married and then divorced after his wife turned lesbian, so that was two genders he drove away. 🤣

12 hours ago, ellentonboy said:

Wait....I thought "side" meant I was the guy he fucked on the "side", as he had a partner.  

I thought it was just a term that all the 20 somethings used.  

Like "Side piece". I thought about that once too, then I consulted I think Urban Dictionary after a brief web search and got corrected. 

And I wish it was only 20-somethings. In my own experience, it gets defined as "a noob who thinks he wants to be with a guy, but dislikes most of the things that guys might do together, including oral and penetration". If it did mean side dish, at least someone's salad might be getting tossed. 🤣

On 2/10/2025 at 3:46 AM, Leobboy said:

Bleachy 🤢

I was waiting for someone to mention that. Often it tastes a bit like pool water.

1 minute ago, Hungryforbbc said:

Depends on what they have been eating but generally it’s thick and sweet with a salty aftertaste 

I've found a more savory, slightly bitter flavor to it, combined with that pool water. Asparagus and Brussel sprouts are a huge turn-off. It's not at all unpleasant to me.

3 hours ago, Willing said:

Mines sweet,  eat a lot of ice cream 🍦 

Now that has me curious to try. 😉

On 2/25/2023 at 11:28 AM, FelchingPisser said:

This feels like a topic from 2008.  I haven't seen condom use for a very long time and I play a lot in public spaces. 

But I'm not a cumdump....so maybe I just don't see it.

I was thinking the same thing. 

I had a condom nazi for a bottom exactly one time in the last 15 or so years. I tried, really did, but it wasn't happening so I told him to find someone else, not interested in something so boner-killing. I've never had to be asked and even discussion of status now doesn't happen that often.

Only in online hookups is it ever a conversation because it's stated on a profile.

5 hours ago, leakyhole said:

I just sit on their bare cocks and either they protest or they don't.

They don't.

Likewise from a top perspective. When someone tries to make conversation about 'safe' or 'condoms', it goes no further. Want to impale yourself on me raw? You won't hear me complaining.

I've encountered this more and more, and it comes down to people not bothering to read any longer versus looking at the pictures. But that's another tale about apps seeming to regress people in real life situations.

On 8/22/2025 at 10:38 AM, Iker80 said:

But I have to admit I so far pass by side guys. But yeah, there's no substitute for getting your prostate worked over or fucking a guy, no plans to quit that ever!

Could not agree more. It feels like a total waste of time and effort to me when we clearly are not on the same wavelength to start. To me, it's like walking into the car dealer because you want a new car that has some power to it and having the smarmy salesperson show you only bicycles and tricycles proclaiming how fantastic the "open air/self-powered experience" is. Or...

5 hours ago, KindaBasic said:

...I guess, think that I am Burger King. They probably think I’m one of them, because they are usually surprised when they can’t get it their way. 

Just like I can't imagine walking into Burger King and only wanting onion rings or fries and a drink, or sitting down at a steak house and ordering a caesar salad and asparagus with béarnaise, I would miss the climaxes that make the experience fulfilling to me. Orgasms can be incredibly cathartic and amazing. But without that experience, it feels like I'm trying to make a meal composed of 'side dishes'.

6 hours ago, KindaBasic said:

Everybody wants to be special and have their own unique label these days. Which I guess is okay, but I wish they would agree on a description. The thing I find annoying is when a “side” hits me up after reading my profile, where I make it clear what I’m looking for is to get fucked, just to tell me they are not into penetration. 

XX and XY. Rarely is it ever XXY or XYY for the specific sexes ("following the science"). But you're right, I once saw a drop-down list that exceeded the normal scroll line of gender descriptions and I thought I needed a translation guide to understand what all of these are. When it comes down to getting our freak on, I simply want to know if between us we have two pegs or one peg and a couple possible entry points. Beyond that call yourself what you want. But if I need to read a novel to get to the punchline, I've probably left the conversation. 

(Yes, that was called sarcasm for anyone not so inclined, it's one of my kinks)

12 hours ago, badubydo said:

sorry I’m not spending hundreds of dollars on a plane ticket and hotel costs to go meet some random dude from the internet. Hell I don’t even have the money to do so. And if I did, there are plenty of places within the U.S. I’d rather go see haha. 

That's my hard-and-fast rule: If I need to involve my travel agent in my sex life, it's not happening. I broke that rule exactly one time when I wasn't in a great frame of mind.

There's a much longer story about the early days of the internet, early Instant Messaging Apps, exposing a Catfish (before that was even a term) and how I wound up in a remote part of West Texas that I might post another time. 

15 hours ago, phillygwm said:

PGN.  And even Philly Mag for a while.  I never liked ads which were full of "thou shalt nots"  Sure, if there are hard nos, include them, but many people are looking for one race, must be muscle bound, young, self-suffient, etc.  A fantasy, though I suppose someone like that would be available for rent 🙂

I, too, don't like About Me's that focus more on "About you", or everything I do not want. So I try to balance it to be informative. Like...

• Have a pic
• Please do not just wink/smile/oink and give me nothing on what you're about.
• Please be local, I don't involve my travel agent in my sex life.

All pretty basic things. And like the post below...

10 hours ago, badubydo said:

People in fact do not read profiles. 
my profile on sniffies and Grindr (before I deleted it) said I cannot host. 
I had people message me. We agree to meet up, then they go “what’s your address?” 
Excuse me? What does my profile say? Then they go “well I can’t host. Car play?” 
then they want ME to find a place to fuck. Like what? 
I consider myself a versatile bottom. More bottom. My profiles/bios state that. They also say who I will top. (Younger/fem/smooth/slender/skinny)
I still get hairy/overweight/old guys sending me ass pictures. 

Yep. Every single one will go through and ask questions already answered if they read my profile rather than use the profile info as a jumping off for conversation.

There is one app/site where the location for literally thousands of guys is dead center of Kansas (Cheyney, KS). I looked up the town. There are more people on apps that say they're from there than actual residents. 🤣 If I see that in a profile, my block game is on point. 

We should probably post the common indicators to determine a bogus profile. Like dudes who say "Am" versus "I am" or "I'm" is indicative of Nigerian/Ghanian scammers.

10 hours ago, verbalBTTM said:

Sinking to a lower level is never the answer, I was taught much like many of us to be tolerant, open, and honest. We are dealing with immature people who suffer from arrested development. They do not understand the conflict within themselves that forces them to lash out at men who are honest about their status. ...

To blame the president is nothing more than a scapegoat. The issue is with each person who responds in such ways, and we should take pity on them. ...

Think how fortunate you are to be in a community of like minded people who say forget political correct speech, no I want disgusting filthy gay sex that would make most sluts grab their pearls. We are free, they are trapped in a mental prison of their own creation.

For a second, I had to check whether I was in the Politics Sub. 🤣 

Here's my observations. I'm an early Gen X'er. That says most of what you need to know about me, except that I'm libertarian/moderate-conservative. I'm tolerant, open and honest knowing that my stances will likely get a few downvotes for my stating my positions simply because they disagree, and that's becoming more the norm than practicing any sort of tolerance whatsoever for differing perspectives. 

I'm growing tired of the constant arguments of "I stepped on Lego in bare feet, it's Trump's fault", or blaming things on one person rather than offering up other options. While I pity them for not having the ability to reason things out for themselves and suggest productive alternatives, a lot of people are just "fatigued" from it all. 

Where I'll differ and need to quote @PozBearWI is the following:

3 hours ago, PozBearWI said:

What makes you think I live in a community of like minded people. 

He's right. As a community, we are loosely cobbled together with a bunch of disparate groups who innately dislike each other. Gays aren't happy with straight views, lesbians are vehemently unhappy with anyone who isn't lesbian, the rest of the rainbow alphabet dislikes bisexuals, trans folks don't generally get much love from any of the other constituencies, the list goes on. Even here, what's there in the LGBTQIAP2S+++ (I'm sure I'm leaving yet another constituency out, ergo the +++) to make anyone think that this community is like-minded? Hell, I'd give my left nut to chuck the notion of politically correct speech and be able to speak what's on my mind respectfully without being gaslit or known as a pariah. We'd all do well to be tolerant of the reality that everyone's perspective is different. Let's agree to disagree, but at least be civil about it. 

5 hours ago, phillygwm said:

When I was young, I relied on old fashioned personal ads in these things called newspapers 🙂  I stated that I wanted guys under X years old (i.e. my age range.)  I couldn't believe the number of responses that started "I'm 64 but look and act much younger."  Now that I'm much closer to 64 than 24, I'd like to think I'm not like those guys.

City Paper, or PGN? I did a City Paper personal once about 30-something years ago and it was...an "interesting" experience. But in re to apps, I've had a similar experience. Mine says "no pic, no chat", give me a bit of opening banter, and here is what I'm NOT looking for (list). Amazingly, it's like my profile outcome excludes anything and everything I was seeking. 🙄

13 hours ago, ellentonboy said:

An individual's status is a fluid thing.  Granted, you know if you are poz or negative, or at least you should. But viral load, and being detectable?  Well, ask me after my next lab. I have gone from being virtually undetectable, to having a viral load over a million.   Now, do guys update their status on their profiles?  Probably not.  That profile may have been created six months ago - and their situation may have changed.  I don't ask questions about status and viral load, but I am honest when asked by a guy who I am going to hook up with.  

Not saying they are all meaning to be deceptive, more like lazy.  If you have a concern, I would proceed with caution.  For me, I just don't care. 

You make great points as usual @ellentonboy. I suppose I was looking at it from more of a housekeeping perspective -- like if you went from Neg to Poz versus the finer points between. Hadn't considered that bit.

And for those who think I don't admit when I'm wrong...here I am humbled. 😀

On 8/11/2025 at 9:14 PM, TXltnpozcumdump88 said:

Not sure he says it's over with the girl and calls it quits. But she always ends up throwing a huge drama fit at his parents house cops get involved and then it becomes a huge mess. 

Two weeks later they are back at the same shit. Either this boy likes this miserable lifestyle or she has something holding over his head. He told me yesterday she might be pregnant. But we live in a red state and no plan b pill available is my understanding from him. 

Definitely go across state lines (I think New Mexico is still OK, as are other surrounding states) for Plan B before she gets knocked up. 

Sounds like you need to introduce him to how man-to-man stuff is and see if he likes it. If he's that passive about taking her shit all the time, good chance he'll make a pretty awesome bottom with the right persuasion. 😉

1 hour ago, PozBearWI said:

I don't know for certain the motivation.  But I know that were I on meds I present less a risk than purportedly "neg" guys who often just don't know.  So why not put 'neg' on PrEP and get hit up more?

It's the mystery behind that lack of an answer. Creates a sense of intrigue and danger. 🤣

Interesting discussion that resurfaced. 😀

Men are definitely more libido driven and more capable of compartmentalizing sex as pleasure rather than an expression of love or deep emotional connection. Most women are emotionally driven from the outset and you aren't getting pussy unless she establishes that bond. Can men be faithful? Yes, but I don't think it's natural based on our biological programming. The emotional bond is great and the sex is different because most guys are more open if they have that depth with a partner. 

I think we can agree that for the majority of us, we're strongly sexual beings, we can get horny quickly and often. If the sexual chemistry is there with another guy, or you at least can feel some connection, it's on. But it doesn't mean we want to be around that other guy 24/7. We just wanna fuck.

It probably explains why the divorce rate for M/M marriages is 29%, M/F marriages is 48%, and F/F is 71%. 🤣

2 hours ago, PozBearWI said:

Grindr hit or miss.  BBRT sadly almost always a miss.  NKP almost always a miss.  BZ isn't a hookup site so I never approach it that way.  But there isn't anyone I chat with here who I wouldn't gladly enjoy a naked romp with...  

So I think I might have a different perspective. NKP has been a large miss for me, more talk than anything concrete. BBRT? That's  iffy but I've made more headway there than elsewhere. Adam4Adam seems to be treated in gay circles as their version of eHarmony, and it yields nothing at all. But I'd say I've had better conversations here that could have more potential for meeting than any of the other four (I totally gave up on Grindr).

2 hours ago, PozBearWI said:

I see some of my fellow poz guys are just outright putting neg.  And honestly I don't see that changes the risk significantly if at all.  

Are you saying that the guys on these sites are falsely saying they're negative but are actually poz? Is this possibly a first step toward stealthing, or just a step to not reveal that until a more detailed conversation occurs? And of those Poz guys, how many of those you know are on meds/undectable versus detectable?

10 hours ago, AirmaxUK said:

Granted that's not a great experience - maybe things are different in the US, but is it not the ATM provider that imposes and profits from those fees, not the venue where it is located?  Venue owners might not even realise the charges programmed into the machine as they wouldn't use it themselves. 

Trust me, they know. So the ATM machine is the same kind (probably same provider) that I'd find in any bodega I shopped at in New York, which is a much more expensive place. The most I'd ever pay -- and trust me, I would only use those on very rare occasions -- is about $3-$4 for a fee. Clearly, the ATM owner is placing the machine there, charging the fee, and then making a deal with the venue owner to include an additional fee for them that's just tacked on. 

Keep in mind, this was a cash-only establishment, so they don't want to pay any merchant fees to Visa/Mastercard/American Express/Discover. I can't blame them, it's a total fucking monopoly that just makes money and provides a service for which they could charge probably a third of what they do. And the banks, card issuers, and the lot are in on the scam. So cash-only is fine with me, but gauging the punters for the 'privilege' of convenience to get cash without finding an outside ATM is just mercenary in nature.