Waiting for the results

[Guest ff-whole]

. Both of you: Have some consideration for your fellow man. Most people out there don't have your chaser's mentality. Those long waits between testing mean that you'll be out there, when you are at your most infectious, spreading the virus amongst your communities. You are endangering the tops, whose seed you so desperately want -- especially the uncut ones. I'll just call it inconsiderate, though I want to use much stronger language.

I find this pretty accusing...

I know the risk pretty good, and don't look forward on getting poz at all, but like I wrote, barebacking and being a total bottom is just what I love...

I know I am still negative and maybe in a month or three, I might be in the USA and able to get tested often and get Prep.

I don't want to give anybody any desease, but everybody should know he is taking a risk.

I appreciate the concern and am greatful for the support. That is no problem, but I don't like selfrightiousness.

I like this site for its openness and great friendliness.

So thanks to all...

Peace and lots of sex...

[Poz1956]

I apologize. I didn't check your profile, or see your location. I jumped the the conclusion that you were from the US or UK or Canada or one of the other first world nations where testing was more accessible.

I live in Canada.

I must have seen just one to many "I can't wait to become Poz" posts that day, and got a little hot under the collar and emotional. At least partly in my defence, mspchaser jumped on your thread and in post 3 said "I'm waiting for that poz result! I can hardly wait" & "I'll continue to seek out whatever loads I can get with preference to poz." With his name and text, he clearly is a chaser, and he is in the US. Both of you had roughly a year between testings. The best testing practices are every three months, or at the very least every six months. I just lumped you two together.

I'd have to find the tread and check the dates, but I'd be willing to bet it was around the same couple of days I was having a fight with someone who suggested that tops only needed to get tested once every two years.

Knowing what we know now, I caught HIV in the fall of 1982 or spring of 1983. That's about 1.5 to 1.75 years after the first few cases of an rare cancer showed up in New Your City, and a dozen people had an odd pneumonia in San Francisco. We didn't know what caused it, and we didn't know how it was transmitted. The first booklet on the principals that became harm reduction guidelines "How to have Sex in an Epidemic" had not even been published in New York yet. The words Safe and Sex had never been used in the same sentence. Condoms were used to prevent pregnancy, and gay men didn't get pregnant.

I had a one night roll in the hay (sex) with a man from here that visited New York frequently. He went to all the leather bars, and bathhouses -- the "sex on premises" sites. I had a fun night with him. It was adventuresome sex - things I'd never tried before. That was the first time I'd ever rimmed someone. A few days later, I got fevers and chills and developed a massive throat infection. (That's too soon for fuck flu.) My tonsils swelled up so large I could not swallow my own spit, let alone food or water. I went to the hospital. When they lanced (cut open) my tonsils the puss came out with such force it splashed across the doctor's chest. It smelled exactly like shit. I remember asking the doctor about that. He said "it's all the same bacteria through the digestive track." I spent two weeks in the hospital on intravenous antibiotics. While thinking of the story now, I remember fevers, chills, and night sweats, and the tonsils swelling up again a couple of months later, just before I had the tonsils removed. Hmm - Now THAT could have been my seroconversion.

I do not blame the rimming, or tonsil infection for causing my HIV. But it seems logical that with him spending a lot of time in New York, at the time when (I think it was still called GRID then) was exploding with many new cases every week, and him tolling the kind of places that would have spread HIV like crazy, that I probably caught it from him. I'm pretty sure we both topped each other one or more times that night. (Hey, how many details can you remember for a one night stand 32 years ago?). I remember he moved back to Calgary from New York, after his lover's death in the early 90's. I know I attended his funeral a year or two later.

As you can tell from my nickname, I was diagnosed in 1985, when an allergic reaction put me back in the hospital. They ignored the allergic reaction symptoms, asked if I was gay (my partner was pacing in the waiting room), and though nothing was said, it was clear what they thought. I didn't see any staff again, without them wearing gowns, masks, gloves, booties, hats, face splash shields -- the full medical drape. There were bio-hazard disposal bins in the hall, and a bio-hazard sign on the door to my room. Every day some new problem in a major system (lungs, heart, liver, kidneys) appeared. It was two weeks before Christmas 1985, and I did not think I was going to live till Christmas. A week later, after tons of tests, and the complications from the allergic reactions settled down, with no treatment other than IV fluids, I suspect they really only flushed the toxic drug out of my system. The doctor walked into my room and said "We finally think we've figured out what you've got! With think you have AIDS!" The tone was "I won the lottery! Millions of dollars!" Which I suppose, for him it was like a lottery. A young Internal Medicine Resident (junior doctor), and he was seeing his first case of this rare new disease. 1985 was the first year an HIV test was available. He asked for permission to do the test. I said yes. They drew blood. There were lots of good reasons for NOT wanting to know the answer back then. It was the height of the AIDS panic. People were being fired, evicted, burnt out of their homes. I changed my mind, but it was too last - the test was done, and it came back Poz. Looking at old statistics, I was the probably the 30th person diagnosed in my province, and by the time I was diagnosed, half of the other 29 were already dead. No treatments were available until 1989. The great death stopped about a year after the triple drug cocktails started in 1996.

HIV has changed my life in ways to numerous to count. Carrier paths I didn't take. Love interests I did not pursue. A future retirement I did not save for, because I did not expect to live that long. Like Bear, I too am suffering early aging, and long term effects of the drugs, or the virus, or both. Different from his, but still challenging.

It wounds me to see young men getting something we've known how to prevent for 30 years. It terrifies me that there are teens who are seeking HIV with some misguided notion that being Poz will "set them free." It doesn't, and never will. The scariest prediction I've seen, was a US Centre For Disease Control mathematical model that says, for gay men aged 22 now, one half will be Poz by the time they are 50.

Again, I apologize for assuming you were a chaser. But I think you can see that's a very emotional issue for me. I sometimes don't weight my words carefully enough when I think I'm seeing a bug bum boy. Again - Sorry.

I've managed to navigate the last 28 years with only two bareback incidents. One way back in 1992 topping a guy of unknown status (I've used BS justification to convince myself he must have been Poz too.) One was last summer bottoming for another Pozzie. But I've had a really crappy, minimalist sex life. Why am I here? I haven't quite formulated my own question for the "Making the Decision to Bareback" forum. But I will eventually put a thread there.

Understanding more about your situation - I propose this.

I know there are a lot of pin prick, drop of blood, add a drop of reactant, and results show in a minute of two tests out on the net. I know most of them are fake and crap. But with our international reach of members here there may be tests available at a pharmacy in their country, that are small and light and easy to ship. Or maybe one of our members knows of a reputable online place to purchase those tests. There may be problems getting them through customs into your country. But it's worth a try. Maybe we can find a way to get you tests, that allow you to have you're own best recommended testing cycle, with less stress and judgment than you feel in your own medical system. Though it would be wise to use your local system when possible as a double check.

So guys, speak up, any ideas?

I also remember another thread mentioning a licensed generic Truvada manufacturer in India. I believe it was a slightly older formulation. It was less expensive than the US. Again a possible customs problem at your end. I wonder if we could find a way for you to order it, and get it sent to you? Probably a bad idea because of the blood and kidney function tests you'd need regularly.

Maybe we can find a gay or gay friendly doctor in your country, with whom you can form a working relationship, to get you the drugs and tests you need, for proper PrEP follow-up. While I don't know what country you are in, it is possible that Truvada may be available locally for much less than in the US.

Again - throwing the floor open guys. Ideas? Suggestions? Can we find a way to help protect a brother in need?

Edited March 28, 2014 by Poz1956

[Guest JizzDumpWI]

ff-whole, you do have options. Maybe not ideal ones but options nonetheless. It seems you are traveling South America. Do you have a home base, be it siblings place, friends, etc you might get to on occasion? Once you complete one round of tests you can possibly get Indian produced Truvada equivalent. Even months of supply would take very little space traveling. Cost more reasonable than Gilead's product. Whose passport are you carrying (eg, from which country)?

Failing all this go for TasP and serosort to undetectable tops. Getting STI tests are something you should be able to find, maybe not every three months, but if you are finding saunas traveling, there have to be places to test. STI's are not unique to USA, UK and Canada.

All of us here bare, so none of us are pushing condom sex. But we are encouraging self care.

[Guest ff-whole]

@poz1956 apology accepted and all is good...

I defenitly would like to stay negative, but I have to find a way to stay safe and temper my sexual desires.

@jizzdumpwi I travel around daily and stay sometimes out in the wild or on campgrounds... I am a traveling hobo with a small camper, now in S.America, maybe in three months in the USA. I don't know.

Appreciate all advice and wish all people peace, love and lots of sex... ☺

[Guest mspchaser]

mspchaser: Annual testing? WTF? You're seeking Poz guys and only testing annually. Three Months!

Both of you: Have some consideration for your fellow man. Most people out there don't have your chaser's mentality. Those long waits between testing mean that you'll be out there, when you are at your most infectious, spreading the virus amongst your communities. You are endangering the tops, whose seed you so desperately want -- especially the uncut ones. I'll just call it inconsiderate, though I want to use much stronger language.

Being Poz does not set you free. It shackles you, and beats you down the rest of your life. I can pretty much guarantee that at some point in the future you will you wish you hadn't had that intimate encounter with the virus.

Accepting the fact that based on your lifestyle, you have a high chance of becoming Poz is one thing. Eagerly looking forward to it is something else.

Test frequently, When you turn Poz get on the meds. Do it to protect your community.

I'm sorry that you feel "shackled", Poz1956. I make my choices and guys that fuck me make their choices. You, clearly, made your choice and while I don't know the circumstances in which you became HIV+, I will know the circumstances under which I do. I don't take your "guarantees" for anything more than a grain of salt. I've chosen my testing schedule and have no regrets about it whatsoever. The men that I have sex with are aware that I have unprotected sex with other men and am aware that as of my most recent testing date, however far back it may be, I had a certain set of results. And I am aware of the same from them. That's better protection than those who don't ask or know if they're having sex with a person who is HIV+ or HIV-, HPV+ or HPV-, HSV+ or HSV-, or any other STD/STI.

[Poz1956]

You, clearly, made your choice and while I don't know the circumstances in which you became HIV+ . . .

I guest you didn't read Post 17 in this thread.

I made no CHOICE. There was no CHOICE. I couldn't CHOOSE safer sex, because I caught HIV before the first principles of harm reduction were even published.

I didn't feel I was at any much risk, because it was only happening to guys in the multi-million populations bases. It was happening to the guys went to the baths several nights a week getting fucked by twenty or more guys a night, and sucking another twenty dicks for their coffee break. Guys who huffed down a bottle of poppers a night. (You know, re-reading that I just got struck by the irony that those guys are the roll models the cum dump bottoms are trying to emulate)

I lived in a city of just slightly over a half million. I considered myself lucky if I got laid a couple of times a month. Not one single case of GRID had been reported in Canada. The nearest cases were many thousands of kilometres away. I thought there was very little risk I would get "The Gay Plague." (GRID = Gay Related Immuneo Efficiency the original name of AIDS, years before HIV was discovered)

I've done peer counselling with lots of newly diagnosed guys who thought they were "well aware of the risks." In 28 years, I've never met a single Poz guy who did not wish he had stayed Neg.

You have a CHOICE. You could go on PrEP. Maybe try it for six months or a year. I somewhat jokingly say it gives you all the inconvenience of being Poz, with few of challenges caused by actually being Poz. Of course your other choice is to stay the course you've already laid out for yourself.

Have a PM chat with some of the newly diagnosed guys on here who thought they knew the risks. Ask them how their view of those risks changed when confronted with the reality of actually being Poz.

My thought on testing frequency aren't about you, or your goal of becoming Poz. They are about respect for your play partners, and the broader community. It's about getting you on to treatment quickly, so that you spread the virus to as few people as possible. It's about TasP.

I know that there is nothing I can say that can say that will change your point of view. I'm just a crazy old man whaling against the wind. I've been Poz for over half my life. Luckily I have stayed healthy and never had a life serious or life threatening consequence from HIV. Like Bear, I am suffering early aging, and long term effects of the drugs, or the virus, or both. My challenges are different than his. Living with HIV has social, economic, physiological, physiological and dozens of other effects on your life. You CANNOT know what they all are. I still don't know them all, but I do know there will be new hurdles caused by it in the future.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Poz1956

[Guest JizzDumpWI]

Well said Poz1956. My friend bear is part of the reason I am on PrEP - now that it is available here in US. Locally drug resistant tuberculosis is on the run and it made me think of the chasers here. So I wrote him a tongue in cheek chaser letter about how I needed to get the DRTB (not knowing his own experience with that particular bug). But my point in that was to point out the craziness of desiring a virus. There are many sexy men who I want to enjoy before my end. But I chase men, dick and cum. As you wrote, and I have as well, PrEP lets me be a pig as if I were already poz, without the side effects of being poz.

I should add the guys before me who have been with this disease all along, including you and bear, plus the host of friends I lost to AIDS helped to pave the way to the treatments we have today.

Edited March 29, 2014 by JizzDumpWI

[6811283]

Mmm hmm. I think maybe the pun is a little too subtle. Admittedly I am new to this forum and don't know how much of what's on here is just fantasy and trash-talking, but the degree of cheerleading pushing young guys, who really have no idea what they're getting into, to get pozzed as if it's the greatest thing on earth is disturbing. The poz guys I know (admittedly they are 30+) have had a rough ride of it. Maybe it's all good fun in your 20s, but it's really not something to make light of.

I am thankful that what I've read on here so far, especially the honest posts by guys who have been poz for a long time, have helped me make my choice: it's PrEP for me, and I hope more users on this site will help educate younger guys to look into it.

[Guest ff-whole]

I can only hope that Prep is going widely available as an over the counter drug like condoms are for birth/std control...