Trump wins bigly, world to end tomorrow...

[viking8x6]

12 hours ago, ktopper said:

It all began with a topic I started as a troll of some posters who believed (or at least pretended they believed) that the election of Pres. Trump would lead to much evil. Most here saw what I was doing and some saw the humor in it. 

But I cannot and will not tolerate lies designed to drive wedges between segments of our society without speaking out. Identity politics at its worst.

I was one of the ones who saw what you were doing and found humor in it. And no, you didn't piss off the moderation staff "big time". Things in this topic just got out of hand with petty insults. Several minor infractions were handed out and the thread was locked temporarily. We do have to read this stuff, y'know. But thanks for reminding me I intended to unlock it. Carry on, MacDuff!

And I thoroughly agree with you about "lies designed to drive wedges between segments of our society." Please *do* speak out about those on BZ, and if you think they are seriously harmful, report the posts.

 

[PozBearWI]

Thanks @viking8x6  You and I have already discussed my desire to reward you (admitted, the reward will be mutual) for your work.  Well, yeah, OK, I would do those things with you regardless.  🙂  Naked hug and grope brother!

Lies...  Some probably yes, but I think mostly it is easy to be misinformed these days.  There is a fair amount of outright wrong information; and plenty of misleading.  Whether that is intentional or not is difficult to say; and perhaps it shouldn't matter.  

[ktopper]

42 minutes ago, PozBearWI said:

Thanks @viking8x6  You and I have already discussed my desire to reward you (admitted, the reward will be mutual) for your work.  Well, yeah, OK, I would do those things with you regardless.  🙂  Naked hug and grope brother!

 

Have a good one guys.

[ktopper]

Some think I am a rabid right-wing nazi because I support Trump. I have at different times been a registered Democrat and a registered Republican. I lived for a time in the southern Appalachia area. I registered as a Democrat at that time because local and state offices were decided in the primaries. The Republican Party would field a candidate but the only people to vote for him was his mother and possibly his spouse sometimes. This was due to the Civil War sentiments that still held sway. This has changed in recent years.

But being from the western U.S. I have always voted my conscious.

This meant Jimmy Carter in 1976 (my first time voting). I still think he was an under rated President.

Carter again in 1980. He lost to Reagan.

Reagan in 1984. He won re-election.

I wrote someone in for the '88 election because I didn't like Dukakis and detested Bush the Elder.

Voted for Clinton in '92, won that one.

Bob Dole in 1996. He lost to Team Bill and Hillary.

Al Gore in 2000. Didn't like him much but liked Bush the Younger, AKA Shrub, even less.

Voted for Ralph Nader in 2004. Didn't like Kerry and Shrub gave me the absolute raging fantods.

Obama in 2008. McCain made me want to punch a hole in a brick wall.

Mitt Romney in 2012. Had to hold my nose for that one.

Been MAGA since 2016. Note I said MAGA, not Republican. I have long held the belief that Republican and Democrat are two wings of one party. My voting record reflects that.

 

 

[Erik62]

4 hours ago, ktopper said:

Some think I am a rabid right-wing nazi because I support Trump. I have at different times been a registered Democrat and a registered Republican. I lived for a time in the southern Appalachia area. I registered as a Democrat at that time because local and state offices were decided in the primaries. The Republican Party would field a candidate but the only people to vote for him was his mother and possibly his spouse sometimes. This was due to the Civil War sentiments that still held sway. This has changed in recent years.

But being from the western U.S. I have always voted my conscious.

This meant Jimmy Carter in 1976 (my first time voting). I still think he was an under rated President.

Carter again in 1980. He lost to Reagan.

Reagan in 1984. He won re-election.

I wrote someone in for the '88 election because I didn't like Dukakis and detested Bush the Elder.

Voted for Clinton in '92, won that one.

Bob Dole in 1996. He lost to Team Bill and Hillary.

Al Gore in 2000. Didn't like him much but liked Bush the Younger, AKA Shrub, even less.

Voted for Ralph Nader in 2004. Didn't like Kerry and Shrub gave me the absolute raging fantods.

Obama in 2008. McCain made me want to punch a hole in a brick wall.

Mitt Romney in 2012. Had to hold my nose for that one.

Been MAGA since 2016. Note I said MAGA, not Republican. I have long held the belief that Republican and Democrat are two wings of one party. My voting record reflects that.

 

 

I was always taught at school, I was at school long before the independent concept arose, that the United States was an essentially two party system just as Australia, the UK & New Zealand USED to be. I have found world politics particularly disturbing over the last 10-12yrs. This last US election increased this feeling but, I was damned sure that the REPUBLICAN Convention elected Trump as the Republican nominee. Now you are trying to tell me that the Republicans & the Maggot (sorry Maga) parties are SEPARATE ENTITIES.  HOW can you not be a Republican, if you voted for the Republican nominee🤔🤔?? Somewhere along the way, my understanding got VERY LOST & I am flumoxed.

[viking8x6]

6 hours ago, ktopper said:

I have at different times been a registered Democrat and a registered Republican. I lived for a time in the southern Appalachia area. I registered as a Democrat at that time because local and state offices were decided in the primaries. The Republican Party would field a candidate but the only people to vote for him was his mother and possibly his spouse sometimes. This was due to the Civil War sentiments that still held sway. This has changed in recent years.

Sort of recent, anyway. I found this mildly amusing, because I moved to West Virginia in '17 and registered Republican for exactly the same reason (because local and state offices were decided in the primaries).

2 hours ago, Erik62 said:

I was always taught at school, I was at school long before the independent concept arose, that the United States was an essentially two party system...

Now you are trying to tell me that the Republicans & the Maggot (sorry Maga) parties are SEPARATE ENTITIES.  HOW can you not be a Republican, if you voted for the Republican nominee🤔🤔??

The US *is* essentially a two-party system.  MAGA isn't a party, it's a political movement, closely aligned with Donald Trump, whose politics are NOT aligned well with those of the old-guard Republican party here in the States.  More here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Make_America_Great_Again

You can certainly vote for the Republican nominee without being a member of their party, and without agreeing with their party's platform. Most American voters who are not affiliated with one of the two major parties will nevertheless vote for their candidates (because otherwise their vote effectively doesn't count, as discussed at length elsewhere on this forum...)

[PozBearWI]

And adding to @viking8x6; we rarely get to vote for what we believe will be "the best" candidate.  We're often left with what we believe is the least worst candidate; or who will do the less damage while also supporting decisions to which we agree.  Our system is designed to slow down rapid changes with the idea to make those decisions more rationally and less emotionally.  

[ktopper]

5 hours ago, Erik62 said:

I was always taught at school, I was at school long before the independent concept arose, that the United States was an essentially two party system just as Australia, the UK & New Zealand USED to be. I have found world politics particularly disturbing over the last 10-12yrs. This last US election increased this feeling but, I was damned sure that the REPUBLICAN Convention elected Trump as the Republican nominee. Now you are trying to tell me that the Republicans & the Maggot (sorry Maga) parties are SEPARATE ENTITIES.  HOW can you not be a Republican, if you voted for the Republican nominee🤔🤔?? Somewhere along the way, my understanding got VERY LOST & I am flumoxed.

In the USA one can vote across party lines without it affecting his party affiliation. One can also vote a split ticket, which means you can vote for candidates for different positions from different parties, as I sometimes do. You can also "write in" someone who is not supported by either party. This sometimes decides local elections but is a waste of ink for state and federal positions. I sometimes do it as a protest vote.

I am currently registered as a Republican. Trump ran on a Republican ticket. But he has refocused the party away from the old guard war mongers of the last several decades, the so-called neocons, with their ties to the military-industrial complex and wars for profit. The neocons are still a force to be reckoned with within the Republican party and are not above back stabbing Trump and siding with their Democrat buddies. The American public is tired of endless wars and sees the Democrat party as a danger to peace because of their efforts to gin up wars with Iran and Russia.

When I say the Republicans and Democrats have been two wings of one party I mean there hasn't been much difference between them. They have been mostly interchangeable. Since Trump came on the scene in 2016 they have began to split into two genuinely different parties and the difference was pronounced in the last election. The "woke" radicals have hijacked the Democrat party and the MAGA movement has moved the Republican party in a more populist direction. The leftists can bemoan these facts but a majority of Americans have rejected what the left is trying to peddle.

[alphatop32]

24 minutes ago, ktopper said:

In the USA one can vote across party lines without it affecting his party affiliation. One can also vote a split ticket, which means you can vote for candidates for different positions from different parties, as I sometimes do. You can also "write in" someone who is not supported by either party. This sometimes decides local elections but is a waste of ink for state and federal positions. I sometimes do it as a protest vote.

I am currently registered as a Republican. Trump ran on a Republican ticket. But he has refocused the party away from the old guard war mongers of the last several decades, the so-called neocons, with their ties to the military-industrial complex and wars for profit. The neocons are still a force to be reckoned with within the Republican party and are not above back stabbing Trump and siding with their Democrat buddies. The American public is tired of endless wars and sees the Democrat party as a danger to peace because of their efforts to gin up wars with Iran and Russia.

When I say the Republicans and Democrats have been two wings of one party I mean there hasn't been much difference between them. They have been mostly interchangeable. Since Trump came on the scene in 2016 they have began to split into two genuinely different parties and the difference was pronounced in the last election. The "woke" radicals have hijacked the Democrat party and the MAGA movement has moved the Republican party in a more populist direction. The leftists can bemoan these facts but a majority of Americans have rejected what the left is trying to peddle.

Well said. 

What the left tried to peddle were the open borders, rising inflation, unchecked lawlessness and crime in major cities, defunding the police, relentless gaslighting, pervasive censorship, cancel culture, the politicization of the justice system, the aggressive promotion of transgender ideology to mainstream Americans and the LGB community, and a war-mongering stance aimed at igniting conflicts worldwide....That made me realize the current Democratic Party veered off from its earlier stance and became the real Nazi party. If they had a chance, they would have sent people to the gas chambers....(well, some democrats on social media did talk about rounding up, isolating, and dumping the unvaccinated in seperate camps!).  

[TaKinGDeePanal]

2 hours ago, ktopper said:

In the USA one can vote across party lines without it affecting his party affiliation. One can also vote a split ticket, which means you can vote for candidates for different positions from different parties, as I sometimes do. You can also "write in" someone who is not supported by either party. This sometimes decides local elections but is a waste of ink for state and federal positions. I sometimes do it as a protest vote.

I am currently registered as a Republican. Trump ran on a Republican ticket. But he has refocused the party away from the old guard war mongers of the last several decades, the so-called neocons, with their ties to the military-industrial complex and wars for profit. The neocons are still a force to be reckoned with within the Republican party and are not above back stabbing Trump and siding with their Democrat buddies. The American public is tired of endless wars and sees the Democrat party as a danger to peace because of their efforts to gin up wars with Iran and Russia.

When I say the Republicans and Democrats have been two wings of one party I mean there hasn't been much difference between them. They have been mostly interchangeable. Since Trump came on the scene in 2016 they have began to split into two genuinely different parties and the difference was pronounced in the last election. The "woke" radicals have hijacked the Democrat party and the MAGA movement has moved the Republican party in a more populist direction. The leftists can bemoan these facts but a majority of Americans have rejected what the left is trying to peddle.

There’s a very simple way to end enthusiasm for wars - repeal the GI Bill (without it affecting those who are benefiting from it as at the day before it is repealed), and remove all Military presence from High Schools, plus close down all Military Schools. 
 

Why do most Americans enlist? It pays for college. Mind you, the South would hate it as at least one base would close due to lesser numbers. Also, end the Selective Service Draft. 

[Erik62]

7 hours ago, viking8x6 said:

Sort of recent, anyway. I found this mildly amusing, because I moved to West Virginia in '17 and registered Republican for exactly the same reason (because local and state offices were decided in the primaries).

The US *is* essentially a two-party system.  MAGA isn't a party, it's a political movement, closely aligned with Donald Trump, whose politics are NOT aligned well with those of the old-guard Republican party here in the States.  More here: [think before following links] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Make_America_Great_Again

You can certainly vote for the Republican nominee without being a member of their party, and without agreeing with their party's platform. Most American voters who are not affiliated with one of the two major parties will nevertheless vote for their candidates (because otherwise their vote effectively doesn't count, as discussed at length elsewhere on this forum...)

Wow😱, thanks guys. Thanks for all the info, regarding US party politics. My comment was really a very "tongue in cheek" throwaway line about how random  political party allegiance has become & also how splinter groups have become a somewhat sinister, & pervasive fact in today's political world. 

  As with the US, Australia's mainstream political parties are morphing into a different page, in the same book.This unfortunately, is happening throughout the western (Democracies).

  Anyway, your comments have proved very educational & appreciated

 

 

[Erik62]

1 hour ago, TaKinGDeePanal said:

There’s a very simple way to end enthusiasm for wars - repeal the GI Bill (without it affecting those who are benefiting from it as at the day before it is repealed), and remove all Military presence from High Schools, plus close down all Military Schools. 
 

Why do most Americans enlist? It pays for college. Mind you, the South would hate it as at least one base would close due to lesser numbers. Also, end the Selective Service Draft. 

Enlisting as a way to gain higher education is unfortunately the only way lower socio economic students have access to degrees & diplomas. Independent nations also require defence forces that can "aid" in the de-esculation of rogue states (Russia, China, Israel) from their land grabbing agendas. Defence also provides a large section of any countries employment base. Throughout history there has been one particular country that has willingly / unwillingly taken the role of international "peace keeper", because there has always been smaller despotic leaders with delusions of dominance & grandeur. It is a tight rope we walk 🤔🤔🤔. 

  It would be nice to think that this personell could be better utilised in civil defence mode, flood, fire assistance, other national disasters & to follow through with rebuilding efforts. 

[BootmanLA]

On 11/19/2024 at 12:37 PM, ktopper said:

When I say the Republicans and Democrats have been two wings of one party I mean there hasn't been much difference between them. They have been mostly interchangeable.

If you only look at a very few issues, sure.

If you look at, say, same-sex marriage specifically and LGBT protections more broadly - including your very right to legally have sex with another man - huge difference.

If you look at labor rights vs kowtowing to corporations, huge difference.

If you look at women's reproductive autonomy, huge difference.

If you look at support for public education as a concept (open to all, financed by all), huge difference.

If you look at environmental protection vs. corporate profits at any cost, huge difference.

I'm sure there are other areas, but these are some very meaningful areas of policy difference between the two parties and they have absolutely NOT been interchangeable. 

[BootmanLA]

On 11/19/2024 at 1:11 PM, alphatop32 said:

That made me realize the current Democratic Party veered off from its earlier stance and became the real Nazi party. If they had a chance, they would have sent people to the gas chambers....(well, some democrats on social media did talk about rounding up, isolating, and dumping the unvaccinated in seperate camps!).  

Well, now the GOP is in charge, and the Texas government has already offered Trump a huge ranch on the border they just purchased, specifically to use as a concentration camp. Oh, sorry, correction, "deportation center". They called the camps in Europe by all sorts of names, too, as I recall.

But let's pretend that all they're going to do is deport people here illegally. Not a single US citizen or other legal resident will "accidentally" get swept up in this mass deportation craze, just like it's crazy that talk that the federal government could lose track of a thousand or so babies separated at the border from their parents and - ooops! - well, they were fostered out somewhere, we don't know where, we certainly didn't keep any actual records of where they went, or insist that the people given custody keep checking in. And anyway, that was then and we promised we'd mostly never do that again. Mostly.

Again, let's pretend. We've gotten rid of the illegal immigrants. Housing prices have jumped another 35% almost across the board because there aren't nearly enough workers and the citizen workers are demanding $60 an hour to put roofs on in 105-degree weather. Groceries, especially produce, have shot up by 300% because of lack of harvesters and the fact we can't import affordably any longer because that involves a 25% tariff. Hello, $28 side salad upcharge at Chili's! The cost of car repairs, meanwhile, is 50% higher than it used to be because even for US cars most of the parts are made somewhere else and - oh! tariffs again.

Unrest is rising. People are starting to demonstrate (peacefully, for now) but it's very bad optics for Hair Furor's agenda. Where, oh where, could they get these people "out of sight" so things don't look as bad as they seem? And maybe it'll send a message, too, that if you mouth off as a protester too much, no one knows where you are any more.

It's not nearly as far fetched as it sounds. Who would have thought we'd still have prisoners sitting in Gitmo, still awaiting trial - supposedly - more than 20 years after they were "picked up" and rendered there?

Never assume even a relatively benevolent government can't do ugly things like this. One headed by someone who openly admires Hitler, the NK Kims, Putin, and other authoritarians around the world? Hah.