Will Trump cuts result in brain drain instead of swamp drain?

[tallslenderguy]

"As the Trump administration cut billions of dollars in federal funding to scientific research, thousands of scientists in the U.S. lost their jobs or grants — and governments and universities around the world spotted an opportunity.

The “Canada Leads” program, launched in April, hopes to foster the next generation of innovators by bringing early-career biomedical researchers north of the border.

Aix-Marseille University in France started the “Safe Place for Science” program in March — pledging to “welcome” U.S.-based scientists who “may feel threatened or hindered in their research.”

Australia’s “Global Talent Attraction Program,” announced in April, promises competitive salaries and relocation packages.

“In response to what is happening in the U.S.,” said Anna-Maria Arabia, head of the Australian Academy of Sciences, “we see an unparalleled opportunity to attract some of the smartest minds here.”

Since World War II, the U.S. has invested huge amounts of money in scientific research conducted at independent universities and federal agencies. That funding helped the U.S. to become the world’s leading scientific power — and has led to the invention of cell phones and the internet as well as new ways to treat cancer, heart disease and strokes, noted Holden Thorp, editor-in-chief of the journal Science."

[think before following links] https://www.yahoo.com/news/us-world-class-scientific-talent-044354089.html?.tsrc=daily_mail&segment_id=DY_VTO_CORE&ncid=crm_19908-1475736-20250525-0--A&bt_user_id=LLKLPqezFjBbQFr7vGpdFavkz%2Ff5iAIN8h9mPIqKG200Q7kpMEwLuiwDb0q8aUN3&bt_ts=1748172747769

[BlueSaphir]

This is exactly why I never voted for Trump or republicans. 

[NWUSHorny]

Many of his supporters are certainly hoping so. The only reason they wanted to drain the swamp was to fill it with toxic waste.

[TT2025]

Brain drain it will be..

Actually I was reading some interesting piece (I think in New Yorker) about lost grants to multi-year research projects. You paid for half of the research, now don't like the topic or the direction so you cut it half way.. really interesting way to save money. Well it actually necessarily wasn't about "woke" topics, but eg. shortfalls in access to health care concerning minorities. (Some potential to save lives AND MONEY..), but got cancelled anyway.

Life is short... so will these meaningful research capable people wait to next term? Probably not. And will these people return in the next term? It depends.. so you should expect negative balance outcome.

[Rillion]

 

Trump is the creature from the black lagoon. He was never going to drain the swamp. He is now charging $5 million to have a one on one dinner with people that want his ear. The only draining he is doing is draining money into super PACs which will launder money into his and his families pockets. 

[nanana]

On 5/25/2025 at 8:44 AM, tallslenderguy said:

Since World War II, the U.S. has invested huge amounts of money in scientific research conducted at independent universities and federal agencies.

I think this is a very interesting point @tallslenderguy . However, I struggle to see the morality of putting these costs on the back of the taxpayer when they end up as massive corporate profits for big pharma especially. It does seem like a waste to slash and burn programs that generate value but I’d like to see that as leverage at least in negotiations on drug prices and other consumer goods that benefit from this tax redistribution. 

[tallslenderguy]

1 hour ago, nanana said:

I think this is a very interesting point @tallslenderguy . However, I struggle to see the morality of putting these costs on the back of the taxpayer when they end up as massive corporate profits for big pharma especially. It does seem like a waste to slash and burn programs that generate value but I’d like to see that as leverage at least in negotiations on drug prices and other consumer goods that benefit from this tax redistribution. 

i too "struggle to see the morality" ... of our current 'system,' or social structure? i think morality is individual, and there are moral and immoral people on both sides of the divide of capitalism and socialism.  

For instance, i wonder and day dream about a healthcare/pharmaceutical system where say research science is performed built on more of a socialist foundation.  Being simplistic, i imagine an enhanced NIH vs "big pharma."  

i did some investigation a few years back and learned the average cost of developing a new drug in the US is about 5 billion dollars. The shocker for me was that half of that cost was profit.  So, i imagine a world where we bypass the corporate structure profit imperative. We could give all the scientists a raise, giving greater incentive to be a scientist in the US, and still have much cheaper drugs. i don't think "profit" is an evil word or concept, but i think we should question how profit is made and distributed. Again, being simplistic. One scientist can use their education in medical research to improve health and the human condition, that same scientist with the same education can go to work for the faux food industry and do research on how to make faux food more addictive (to generate more profit). How does that scientist decide which job to take?  Morality and profit both factor in on an individual level. 

 i think things like healthcare and education should not be for (corporate) profit institutions, that such a system becomes self defeating. i think it could be argued that corporations can make sense in some areas of society, but not in all or every?  There is corporate greed and the corruption that often accompanies that, but corporate greed is just exponential individual greed. So.... "morality" is an issue no matter how we slice it. 

America is no where near social welfare as the goal or motivator as a cultural norm. The highest paid 'teachers' in many large universities are sports coaches, because football games played in massive stadiums are a  huge revenue source for colleges,  while the math club languishes in the basement.

 

 

[TT2025]

9 hours ago, nanana said:

I think this is a very interesting point @tallslenderguy . However, I struggle to see the morality of putting these costs on the back of the taxpayer when they end up as massive corporate profits for big pharma especially. It does seem like a waste to slash and burn programs that generate value but I’d like to see that as leverage at least in negotiations on drug prices and other consumer goods that benefit from this tax redistribution. 

Well.. don't forget that when big pharma earns its billions out of public founded research, it is because public body let them. Don't forget that when some knowledge is public, it can't be patented and everyone can use it. So there is another problem than that of who pays for the research (if the discovery is publicly funded). 

Actually doubt that any meaningful public funding went to particular drug research.. (If it flops in clinical trials you loose big time.)

In my country it is usually basic research, which is funded by public grants. Basic research won't get you any new drugs, usually 'only' general knowledge. New medicine is spin off of that. (And yes, sometimes public cash in if this new knowledge is useful and patented).