Living with HIV... When does life become normal again?

[VersatileBreeder]

Tiger, it sure has been a grieving process. I never thought of it along the lines of "grieving" but it definitely is. I feel like I have lost a loved one. In this case, I guess that "loved one" is the person I thought I was (or thought I knew). I feel like part of me died and I don't know how I am going to make it through the rest of my life with just this other part of me.

What is interesting, Tiger, is I keep telling myself exactly what you said- everything happens for a reason. Now, I can't explain in the grand scheme of life why this happened to me at age 29 (I would have been happier if this happened 20 or 30 years later) and I keep asking myself what is the bright side to this- being infected with a deadly disease that requires lifelong and disciplined medication to keep it under control. The only thing I can possibly fathom as an answer to that is that in the past, I have held myself back from doing a lot of things and being the person I want to be in life. I guess you can say that I took life for granted and I never really saw the big picture with a lot of things. Maybe this event will change me for the better- make me open my eyes, push me over that hump and make me become the person that I want to be. That is kind of what has been keeping me going through the past month and a half, though I am still dealing with all the aforementioned mental issues I stated in my original thread.

It is actually a grieving process. It takes time. I think for me it happened in phases. It is probably still going on. I no longer think about it all the time. One of the most important moments that lead to acceptance for me, was when I actually asked myself "would I do it over again?" I could not be a victim when I knew the honest answer was "yes". I can't say it was worth it, but I do know I would do again. Just keep an attitude that everything happens for a reason. Maybe you can't or won't have certain experiences now that you are poz, but you will also be opened up to new people and experiences that you would not have if you were not positive.

[nekofox]

I'm glad to see you're taking all we said to heart, so definitely, when things get cleared up enough for you mentally, see someone who can guide you through it all since, as you pointed out, you've got a lot of demons to face. Not just having HIV, but also demons that's been eating away at your right to have true balance, instead of a forced fed one that's not the true you.

[hungry_hole]

I have been able to accept that I am poz. I am not in denial about it. What I haven't been able to get past are the feelings of self-blame (I am constantly beating myself up for "letting" myself get HIV),

Those feelings of self-blame are probably quite difficult to overcome for someone who has recently pozzed because it's difficult to deny the personal responsibility aspect of the situation. But at the same time, when it comes to barebacking it seems very difficult for barebackers to be able to stop the risky behaviour. What should a barebacker who enjoys impersonal sex do? Rely on luck and hope to get old enough to stop having sex?

[poz0712]

Poptronic I feel the same way you do. It's been almost two years since I was diagnosed and I still don't feel normal. Anything about HIV bothers me from doctor appointments, meds, blood work etc. At one point I stopped taking my meds for about nine months and I felt a little better because I didn't have the constant reminder of HIV from the pills. One of the things I'm concerned about is if I become undetectable will I feel better about myself? You know at the end of the day regardless if you are undetectable you still have HIV. I don't see it has a milestone.

There aren't any support groups in my area the only support I have found is one online through Facebook. It bothers me for those who do want it and are disappointed when test negative and for those who weren't actively seeking it becomes poz.

[TigerMilner]

. It has been a scary thought, however, to have to know that my health is basically reliant upon a pill that I have to take EVERY day for the REST of my life.

I'll tell you what my doctor told me when I used the "rest of my life" phrase. He said, "No, you only have to take it til there is a cure". Then he assured me that will happen sooner than later. Don't get into the "rest of my life" mindset. Stay in today. And today be grateful we have one pill a day meds that keep us from getting sick and dying. Today.

[VersatileBreeder]

Tiger, I totally agree with you there and I'm trying to not think about it negatively. I actually recently had a similar conversation with a friend of mine who became poz six months ago. He was telling me about how he hates taking pills and how he hates that every time he has to take his pill, it's a constant reminder that he has HIV. My response to him was, "it does suck to have that constant reminder, but you have to feel some sense of gratitude that you are dealing with this in 2014 where that pill will keep you alive and healthy for a very long time, whereas if this were 20 years ago, you would not be so lucky." So, I do see the other side of it.

As for what your doctor said about there being a cure sooner than later, I hope he is right. This disease has been around for a long time and in the very beginning, people thought there would be a cure within a couple of years. Over 30 years later, there still is no cure. Advances in medication have come a very long way and have completely turned the game around on what it means to live with the disease, but still no cure. It makes me wonder if there ever will be a cure or if science has come as far as it can in controlling the disease. Billions of dollars have been spent in hopes for a cure and the end result is sophisticated medication and just knowing that this is a very elusive virus.

I'm not trying to sound like a downer or sound like I am disagreeing with your doctor; I am just stating the facts that I know that make me question whether we really are on the brink of a cure. If we are, that is great and it would definitely be something for us all to look forward to. If not, at least we still have great medication options, which I am sure will only get better and more sophisticated as time goes forward.

I'll tell you what my doctor told me when I used the "rest of my life" phrase. He said, "No, you only have to take it til there is a cure". Then he assured me that will happen sooner than later. Don't get into the "rest of my life" mindset. Stay in today. And today be grateful we have one pill a day meds that keep us from getting sick and dying. Today.

[wood]

Poptronic I feel the same way you do. It's been almost two years since I was diagnosed and I still don't feel normal. Anything about HIV bothers me from doctor appointments, meds, blood work etc. At one point I stopped taking my meds for about nine months and I felt a little better because I didn't have the constant reminder of HIV from the pills. One of the things I'm concerned about is if I become undetectable will I feel better about myself? You know at the end of the day regardless if you are undetectable you still have HIV. I don't see it has a milestone.

There aren't any support groups in my area the only support I have found is one online through Facebook. It bothers me for those who do want it and are disappointed when test negative and for those who weren't actively seeking it becomes poz.

Really a bad idea to stop treatment, if you think taking a pill a day is bad, get resistant to some of the drugs from going off them for no reason, that can cause HUGE side effects. Go back on and don't go off. Its just a pill a day, just like the PrEP I take.

For the OP:

As Im sure you know Im neg, but I also have dated a lot of poz guys and asked them the very question you did, and I will surmise what they have told me. All of their answer were similar in that, some things never are the same, but most things go back to "normal" within a year. For one they never get used to bringing it up with a partner or potential partner. its not an easy conversation, but at the same time they all said it becomes a non issue to them. IE if the person likes me, they like me, if they dont, there are other fish out there. That was the only thing they all said bothered them after the initial year and shock.

For the most part they all said the first 6 months to a year are the worst. At that time you think any cough or cold is death coming, and its always on your mind. Same things with doctors visits. You are anxious for your number and labs to make sure things are working, but after that it becomes routine, just like most people who go to the doctor for yearly checkups. What they all said is that after a while, its just a fact of life, like brushing your teeth, or dealing with other stress. Other problems come and go, and you learn to realize that HIV is a (luckily now) a fairly small issue to deal with. The treatments work, and blood tests every six months are pretty damn easy. From my perspective working in outreach and testing before, it varies from person to person. I know some people that bounced back in a matter of weeks, and I know others that took years, although in fairness that is mostly people with prior depression issues. Talking with anyone will help. You don't need to tell everyone, but if people can help you, let them. Based of what you have said so fair I bet in a couple months you will be fine, and as a bonus it will be summer!!! which makes everyone feel better.

[TigerMilner]

You know i understand the issue of the constant reminders. I went through that and only in reading your posts in the last few days have I realized that I have moved passed that point. Taking my pill everyday is not a big deal, I don't really even think about why I am taking it. I take a ton of vitamins and supplements to stay healthy and I just think of it as one more vitamin. I also have a very good rapport with the pharmacy staff who make sure I don't run out of meds and even ship them to me free of charge so I don't have to go to the special pharmacy. Those people are awesome.

Several people have mentioned support groups and talking to others, but I have to admit that I hated that part in the beginning. I don't live in a large metro area and the only support groups in my area are either condom nazi's or are long-term survivors. The long term survivors are men I admire a lot, but to the newly infected person in 2014 hearing about surviving the 80-90s just terrifies. Our experience as newly infected individuals is so much different than even 5 years ago, that unless you can find a group of newbies, I'd stay away from that. Reaching out on this site was trememdously helpful for me. And now that i am not so freaked out hearing words of wisdom from guys like Bearbandit are awe inspiring.

There is a new site for newbies called HIVster.com You can tell from the title it's geared to a young crowd, but it is very hip and current.

[VersatileBreeder]

Thank you once again for the encouragement, wood. It has been almost two months since I got the news and everyday is an emotional roller coaster. Obviously, now is not as bad as it was in the very beginning when my body was literally in pain from the mental stress, but it has still been very tough. I just can't shake the worries. Constant thoughts invade my mind every minute of every day. Thoughts like- will I be able to get on meds without breaking myself financially (I am trying to figure out ADAP right now, my income qualifies, but my insurance coverage might disqualify me). Will I be healthy? What does my future have in store for me? I just feel like this disease is going to keep me from attaining any of my life's goals and it makes me question my future A LOT.

I didn't really want to bring this up on this site, but I figure that since most people are very candid about things, I should be too.... I've been having suicidal thoughts. Before you get alarmed, let me just repeat- thoughts. Not impulses or anything of the like. If I didn't kill myself when I got the initial diagnosis, I don't see it being something that will likely happen. I have just been wondering things like, "if my life is going to just be (mental) pain and constant worry, in addition to not being able to see any good future ahead of me, is life really worth living... or would it just be easier to call it quits?" Like I said, don't get alarmed. I'm not going to off myself over an HIV diagnosis. But my point is, just simply having these thoughts is far from healthy and I want to be able to shut thoughts like that along with any other negative, unhealthy thoughts out of my head.

It's funny you should mention that summer is coming. Not sure where you're located, but I'm in NJ and winters suck up here. This winter has been particularly cold and the snow has been very bad. I had two minor car accidents with my very un-snow-friendly Mustang because of the snow and ice which cost me a lot of money this season. All in all, winter has always brought seasonal depression on me under normal circumstances, which is why getting my diagnosis smack in the middle of January was probably the worst point in the year I could have gotten it. Summer has always been my favorite season (though the humid sticky heat here in the northeast can be a bitch also). I am hoping that the change of season *may* help bring up my mood as it always has in the past, though this particular year, I am dealing with a stress catalyst I have never had to deal with before.

Really a bad idea to stop treatment, if you think taking a pill a day is bad, get resistant to some of the drugs from going off them for no reason, that can cause HUGE side effects. Go back on and don't go off. Its just a pill a day, just like the PrEP I take.

For the OP:

As Im sure you know Im neg, but I also have dated a lot of poz guys and asked them the very question you did, and I will surmise what they have told me. All of their answer were similar in that, some things never are the same, but most things go back to "normal" within a year. For one they never get used to bringing it up with a partner or potential partner. its not an easy conversation, but at the same time they all said it becomes a non issue to them. IE if the person likes me, they like me, if they dont, there are other fish out there. That was the only thing they all said bothered them after the initial year and shock.

For the most part they all said the first 6 months to a year are the worst. At that time you think any cough or cold is death coming, and its always on your mind. Same things with doctors visits. You are anxious for your number and labs to make sure things are working, but after that it becomes routine, just like most people who go to the doctor for yearly checkups. What they all said is that after a while, its just a fact of life, like brushing your teeth, or dealing with other stress. Other problems come and go, and you learn to realize that HIV is a (luckily now) a fairly small issue to deal with. The treatments work, and blood tests every six months are pretty damn easy. From my perspective working in outreach and testing before, it varies from person to person. I know some people that bounced back in a matter of weeks, and I know others that took years, although in fairness that is mostly people with prior depression issues. Talking with anyone will help. You don't need to tell everyone, but if people can help you, let them. Based of what you have said so fair I bet in a couple months you will be fine, and as a bonus it will be summer!!! which makes everyone feel better.

[poz0712]

Poptronic It's not just a pill a day. I'm taking multiple pills. My doctor visits aren't six months apart. My Dr appts are about every two weeks. I had stopped treatment cause the side effects were making me physically sick unlike the HIV was. Everyone's experience is different. This is my third attempt at treatment a lot of it has to do with the patient doctor relationship. My regimen hasn't changed but I would love to get to one pill a day and my doctor visits be only six months apart.

[VersatileBreeder]

You know i understand the issue of the constant reminders. I went through that and only in reading your posts in the last few days have I realized that I have moved passed that point. Taking my pill everyday is not a big deal, I don't really even think about why I am taking it. I take a ton of vitamins and supplements to stay healthy and I just think of it as one more vitamin. I also have a very good rapport with the pharmacy staff who make sure I don't run out of meds and even ship them to me free of charge so I don't have to go to the special pharmacy. Those people are awesome.

Several people have mentioned support groups and talking to others, but I have to admit that I hated that part in the beginning. I don't live in a large metro area and the only support groups in my area are either condom nazi's or are long-term survivors. The long term survivors are men I admire a lot, but to the newly infected person in 2014 hearing about surviving the 80-90s just terrifies. Our experience as newly infected individuals is so much different than even 5 years ago, that unless you can find a group of newbies, I'd stay away from that. Reaching out on this site was trememdously helpful for me. And now that i am not so freaked out hearing words of wisdom from guys like Bearbandit are awe inspiring.

There is a new site for newbies called HIVster.com You can tell from the title it's geared to a young crowd, but it is very hip and current.

Tiger, I basically just want to get to that point where you are now- where I can take my pill in the morning, go through my day like normal without constantly having HIV on my mind. I mean, what kind of way would that be for a person to live?

As for support groups, there is one near where I live called NJ Buddies. It is a group for all people living with HIV/AIDS and different nights of the week, they have different groups. Monday night is specifically for gay men, so that is likely the one I would go to. I am kind of nervous about going. Oddly enough, my nervousness about going has nothing to do with the HIV part of it, but rather, because I tend to get social anxiety when I go to social settings where I don't know anyone. Though I get nervous about meeting new people, I tend to make friends easily once I do. I just need to suck it up and go.

Good looks on filling me in on the site hivster.com. Thanks for that. I am actually shocked that I haven't come across that site before with all the googling around I have been doing for different HIV resources. I went to it before and it looks like a pretty comprehensive and informative site, so I am interested to see what lies within.

[VersatileBreeder]

Poptronic It's not just a pill a day. I'm taking multiple pills. My doctor visits aren't six months apart. My Dr appts are about every two weeks. I had stopped treatment cause the side effects were making me physically sick unlike the HIV was. Everyone's experience is different. This is my third attempt at treatment a lot of it has to do with the patient doctor relationship. My regimen hasn't changed but I would love to get to one pill a day and my doctor visits be only six months apart.

poz0712, I'm sorry to hear that your treatment has been difficult so far. I really hope you and your doctor are able to find a solution that works and that you can get on an easy and effective treatment plan that will keep you from having to see the doctor so frequently.

In response to your first post on this thread about seeing undetectable as being a milestone... I'm not there yet because I haven't yet started treatment, but once I do start, I think undetectable will be my first milestone. Why do I think poz guys see it as a milestone? Well, let's look at it like this- the majority of guys who are poz likely wish that they were still neg. Now, we know that is impossible, at least until there is a cure. Undetectable, to me, seems to be the closest thing to being neg for a poz guy. Look at the benefits of being undetectable:

1) Your medication, as long as you're taking it, is keeping the virus suppressed to points low enough where it won't do damage to your immune system.

2) Because of the aforementioned reason, you will likely stay as healthy as a neg person, without being sick all the time.

3) The suppression of the virus in your system makes it highly unlikely (I never use the word "impossible") to transmit the virus to others, making you a low risk to other guys you play with.

4) As long as you take your meds and keep the virus at undetectable levels, it won't progress to stages where it will hurt or ultimately kill you.

I think these are the reasons why undetectable is the first milestone for poz guys. To us, it means that we have reached the capacity where WE control the virus and not the other way around.

Again, I really hope that you can and do reach that point.

[fillmyholeftl]

Very Well Said !!

poz0712, I'm sorry to hear that your treatment has been difficult so far. I really hope you and your doctor are able to find a solution that works and that you can get on an easy and effective treatment plan that will keep you from having to see the doctor so frequently.

In response to your first post on this thread about seeing undetectable as being a milestone... I'm not there yet because I haven't yet started treatment, but once I do start, I think undetectable will be my first milestone. Why do I think poz guys see it as a milestone? Well, let's look at it like this- the majority of guys who are poz likely wish that they were still neg. Now, we know that is impossible, at least until there is a cure. Undetectable, to me, seems to be the closest thing to being neg for a poz guy. Look at the benefits of being undetectable:

1) Your medication, as long as you're taking it, is keeping the virus suppressed to points low enough where it won't do damage to your immune system.

2) Because of the aforementioned reason, you will likely stay as healthy as a neg person, without being sick all the time.

3) The suppression of the virus in your system makes it highly unlikely (I never use the word "impossible") to transmit the virus to others, making you a low risk to other guys you play with.

4) As long as you take your meds and keep the virus at undetectable levels, it won't progress to stages where it will hurt or ultimately kill you.

I think these are the reasons why undetectable is the first milestone for poz guys. To us, it means that we have reached the capacity where WE control the virus and not the other way around.

Again, I really hope that you can and do reach that point.

[JerryGumby]

First to give some of my perspective - I've been poz longer than most guys have been alive! - and it remains the least of my problems. Sure didn't start out that way and turning positive un-necessarily ended a flying career in the mlilitary which took me MUCH longer to get over than the hiv. When I was officially diagnosed in '87 - the next words out of my Dr was suggestion to get my affairs in order I had 6-9 months to live. Proved him wrong didn't I. It took some time but I found ways to live with hiv than preparing to die with it! - Still to this day over 27 years later (and probably longer than that) again hiv still remains the least of my problems - health and life wise. Meds were a lot different back then - and side effects made life VERY difficult and about killed me. At one time I was on a combo of like 37 pills a day! - now down to 4-5 with no noticeable side effects. FOR ME -one thing that helped the most was support groups - BUT shop around! - some of them are nothing but woe is me sessions. Then again when I listened to some problems these men were having mine didn't seem like problems at all - gives one great perspective! - Finding a mate was sure a challenge but I lucked out and he remains negative. Part of that was that when we played we played safe but for the last 10-15 we haven't played at all for various reasons and I miss that - he's just my type. But we found ways to deal and pleasantly so. Always nice to have someone to come home to even if it is not sexually. Above all it TAKES TIME - just give it some and seek out ways to LIVE with hiv NOT die from it! - it will get better!

[Poz1956]

Like Bear and Jerry I'm a member of the Methuselah club. Diagnosed in 1985 at the height of the AIDS panic -- and trust me That's a Story and a Half. As best as we can figure, I caught it between the fall of 82 and spring of 83. Like others, I also got the "go home and put your affairs in order" speech. Certainly my experiences were very different than yous will be.

I can relate to the "I'm going to die" thing. It really wasn't until about 2000 when we really knew the multi-drug "cocktails" were truly working, and that we might live out close to a normal lifespan. Before that, every news story that mentioned life expectancy told me "You should already be dead!"

How things have changed. I've recently seen reports that we Pozzies may actually outlive the average man. Why? Because we tend to be more health conscious, and take better care of ourselves. We see doctors regularly, and if we note some change, we point it out, and it's addressed. The average guy sees his doctor once a year, ignores that there is something different, and hopes it will go away. He may not even mention it to the doc until it gets really bad.

I've done a lot of peer counselling with newly diagnosed guys. In my experience, it seems to take about two years to get comfortable with the diagnosis. Before that, every sneeze, every cough, every cut that seems to take too long to heal, brings up the "Is that IT" thoughts. And the "I'm going to die - My life is over" mind frame pops in frequently. Eventually it really does become just a part of you - like the color of your eyes. I'm not being trite. It will always be there, and affect some things you do. It just won't be at the top of your mind all the time.

You go through bouts of beating your self up, and other times when you are totally OK with it. They will resurface again and again over the years, but they won't be as bad as they are now. It really IS a grieving process and takes the amount of time, that is the right amount of time, for you. Everyone is different.

I'm going to start by saying try changing some of the internal talk. When the "BAD ME" stuff comes up, try to replace it with something better. Remember, you were Responsible enough to get yourself tested. You are Taking Care of yourself. You are seeing a Doctor regularly. You are going to go on Meds. That is also something very Responsible, because, as you pointed out, it makes you far less likely to pass it on. In the developed world this hasn't been a "deadly disease" for a long time. Yes - dangerous if left untreated, but otherwise a chronic manageable condition. Scratch the "deadly" from your mind.

Thankfully I live in a place where I receive my HIV meds at not cost. I can't imagine the mental and financial stress you guys in the US face. I know I would probably have perished long ago, if I'd had to pay for them.

Undetectable is the ideal goal, and most people get there within six months. Not everyone does. We have to be careful and not stigmatize the guys who aren't there. Their particular variant of the virus, problems with side effects, or adherence due to "life situations" can cause it. But they are still part of US - The Poz Guys.

Do you want to know how routine the meds can become? I had to go to those 7 daily dose pill cases. I was having trouble remembering if I'd taken my meds, even though I already had. Taking them was such a non-issue that I didn't even remember doing it. Maybe it's old guy brain, or because I just take them without thinking about it. They stopped being a daily reminder of my status a long time ago.

On the subject of a "cure" that's debatable. HIV hides in so many differnt places in the body, they may never be able to totally clear it out of our systems. They may get to a "functional cure," where the virus is still there, someplace, but not reproducing, and no need for daily drugs.

Think carefully about which family and friends you tell. You really never know how someone will react.

Unfortunately there are places where you will have to reveal your stats for the rest of your life. Every time you have a new doctor, dentest, or any kind of medical procedure it comes up. As we get older we have more and more of those kind of tests. Medial staff who you think Should know something about HIV, know nothing. They always want to know what medications you're taking. So it comes out in that.

For example, three weeks ago I got second degree frostbite on six fingers (yea brutal winter here too). I called the provincial health line and spoke to a nurse. Needed to ask, should I go to emergency now, or just see my family doc tomorrow? List all the meds (I take other stuff too - antidepresants, high blood pressure . . .) "What are you taking the antiretrovirals for?" Which of course led to a whole other series of questions. CD4 count just over 500. "Have you ever been told you are imuno-compromised?" Explain to the nurse that docs don't condsider it a problem till CD4s fall below 200. Then "Oh - I have to go talk to my supervisor." Arm yourself with enough knowledge to educate the medical staff you deal with. (Yes the fingers are healing, but damn they hurt with all this typing I've done.)

Ever new doctor you see will ask, "How many people have you had sex with?" I used to answer with a guess. I've recently decided IT'S NONE OF THEIR FUCKING BUSINESS. Next time I'm asked, I going to retort with "How many have you? Does this question have any relevance to the topic we're discussing? Is it just pruient interest on your part? Are you trying to imply I must have been a slut? People who have only ever slept with one person can get it. I know a guy who has slept with 10 people, but only twice without a condom. He was the less risky insertive partner (top), and he's now Poz." That should shut them up.

One issue that will probably never go away is fear of disclosure, and feeling ostracized by the Stigma. Browsing a hook-up website can be like flogging yourself with a mace and razor wire. I've certainly had nights where I was almost in tears with "nobody will ever want me" thoughts. All the "Clean U B 2," "Unclean," "D & D Free," "Healthy," "Hygenic," "Neg Olny," Turn Offs listed as "Poz guys" and "Diseased" -- It grates on your nerves. They objectify and dehumanize us as just "The Infected" "A Disease" - not human at all. Though I admit I did at least get a smile out of "Walking Petri Dishes."

I'm not proud of the fact that I sometimes play "Don't Ask - Don't Tell." I have never lied if I've been asked, but I don't always bring up the topic. With every hookup I go through complex mental math. What's my level of self confidence today? Can I handle a really nasty rejection? Will it make me feel like I want to throw myself off a bridge? How badly do I want this hook-up to happen? Do I desperately need that life affirming human contact, even just a cuddle? If I'm thinking "it might be fun, but I'm not really into this guy," I sometimes use revealing status as an escape valve. How much do I trust the guy? Will he start a whisper campaign with my most personal, private piece of medical information? How much do I like this guy? Don't take that as "if I don't like a guy I won't tell him." If I really like the guy, and I really want to get to know him better. If I think there is potential for him becoming a true friend, a regular fuck bud, or the all illusive relationship material, I feel I MUST tell him before the first time. If I wait till later, I think I loose all credibility for being trustworthy, and destroy any potential for taking it further. If it is defiantly a one night stand, I probably won't tell him.

Behind the keyboard it's relatively easy to say you're Poz. It still ties a knot in your guts. As soon as you do reveal, recognize that you most likely not getting any play time. Be mentally prepared to switch to education mode, because the ignorant slob doesn't know a thing.

In person it's much harder. I've seen intellegent, reasonable, logical, educated people, turn into raging assholes when it's brought up. But no matter how gently they let you down, it stil wounds. I hit back with: "Next time a guy tells you he's Poz, before you give an answer, say 'Thank you! I know that was very difficult for you to tell me.' There are only two reasons a guy will state he is POZ. He is showing his respect for you, and hoping to earn your respect in return." If you I got rejected, I add "Clearly you're worthy of neither!"

Watch this

to see how revealing status conversations usually go. You might not find it BB friendly, but it really shows the Neggie circular logic. (Can't fallow the link? Search YouTube for a video called DDF.)

For some reason the first thought that enters the mind for a large portion of Neggies is "You're mad as hell at the world for getting HIV, and you're trying to get even, by infecting as many people as possible." I always wonder about those guys. Is that what they'd do if they got it? They thought of it first. Remind me again, which one of us is supposed to be the sociopath?

The real truth is, it is the "Clean U B 2," D & D Free," haven't been tested in over a year (or maybe never) guys, who are Poz and don't know they are Poz, that responsible for about 85% of transmissions in our community. About 10% are from guys who know they are Poz, but are not under treatment. Virtually (and maybe even totally) none are from undetectable guys.

On Monday of this week the preliminary results from the European "Partner" study were present CROI 2014. (Conference on Retroviruses and Opportunistic Infections)

The European based Partner study is following a large number of couples in mixed HIV status relationships. We sometimes get cutesy and call them Magnetic couples, because it's a relationship where one person is HIV Positive and the other is HIV Negative. The medical terms used to describe them are Serodiscordant or Serodivergent. The study includes both gay and straight couples. Before this study there was very little research of HIV in gay relationships or anal sex, and none with enough data to draw statistically significant conclusions. All of the Pozzies in the Partner study have an undetectable viral load.

NONE of the HIV Negative partners contracted HIV from their Poz partner, in the first two years of the study. With an estimated 16,000 gay guy bareback fucks (and 14,000 straight ones), ZERO Negative partners caught HIV from their Positive spouse. Including the straight couples, with a cumulative 894 Years of couple following up, there was not a single transmission from the Poz mate.

Based on the number, and type of sex acts, had the Pozzies not been under treatment, the researches would have expected 86 (30%) of the neg partners to catch HIV.

Before we celebrate that as a carte blanche in BBing with neg guys, they are about 95% certain -- their "best guess" is we are 0% likely to transmit. They don't have enough data to get that certainty higher, especially for Poz top cum dumping in a Neg bottom. The outside edge of that statistical certainty means, there is a 32% chance of the Neg bottom becoming Poz withing 10 years. They need 450 more European gay serodivergent couples, and study until 2017 to get that certainty higher. They will probably Never be able to say absolutly zero chance.

But it does gives us hope. And it will give us BIG GUN ammunition to figt back against the Stigma.

There is a certain irony in the fact us guys, who the neggies are most afraid of, are probably going to turn out to be the ones least likely to infect them! Our status is 100% known verses all the "think they're neg" guys. Many of them don't test regularly, if ever.

Fifty percent of the guys who have ever been tested, haven't been tested in over a year. 20% have never been tested. In the guys under 25, 40% have never been tested.

The only person whose status you can be 100% certain of is the guy who tells you he is POZ!

Stick that in your pipe and smoke it, Pozaphobes!

Ok - So I went on a rant. Sorry! (How Canadian of me to apologize.)

Poptronic, I've got lots of knowledge and lots of resources. If you want to chat sometime, let me know.

Edited March 9, 2014 by Poz1956