Why do you think Americans "voted in massive numbers" to "Dump trump", but then 4 years later changed their mind?

[viking8x6]

9 hours ago, harrysmith25 said:

It took you two tries to answer which means you don't enjoy thinking that much more than these people you're talking about.

Or else it means I came up with two different answers for the entertainment value, which means I do.

 

9 hours ago, harrysmith25 said:

Since the people on the TV talked about Trump "going to jail" for every single day of the 4 years of... 

How could they forget the idea of him being a "mad tyrant" etc, when the media said it every day?

No one said a thing about any "mad tyrant" "going to jail" on MY television; I don't know about yours. But I'd hazard a guess that yours isn't tuned in to the same channels as those of the left-wing American proletariat any more than mine is. In which case, how would you know?

[VistaCaBB]

Because the Left went WAY too far left for their own base.  Trans issues are in the news and they are less than 2% of the population and trans athletes are less than 0.002% of athletes.  Look at what the California governor is doing now, he's backtracking to make himself look better to California Democrats and throwing trans under the buss and backing over them. 

[BlueSaphir]

I stand  corrected, but it seem it best to consult with attorney regarding to try seek citizenship in Australia with being HIV positive for REAL complex answers. 

[PozTalkAuthor]

I fear that post-pandemic issues, and wars, have contributed relevantly. 

I'm in the EU, I have little knowledge about American system. But I fear that Trump attracted many people as he said what folks wanted to hear. 

LGBT matters are not the issue, I think. They care for another kind of message: about migrants, and about economy.

This "make america great again" has been like a magnet.

And? Trans/lgbt rights aren't the only ones to be rolled back. It's gradually decreasing disability rights too. Btw, I don't think it's matter of self-harm.

I have had the chance to talk to several folks who voted far-right, both in EU and US.

The sensation I have, is that far-right gives a sense of safety, discipline, "we do what we promise"

And regarding inclusion policies, I feel they are tired to be used. So in the end they prefer "cut offs" rather than "washing". 

I personally am against those DEI policies where they write and talk, place flags and messages around, pride-branded products, but then do less than nothing concretely.

But in the end I'd never trust someone who cuts everything off. Improve what's wrong, rather than erasing history!

[TaKinGDeePanal]

16 hours ago, BlueSaphir said:

I checked Australia policies. And nothing is mentioned about it. 

Depends on the type of visa being applied for: [think before following links] https://immi.homeaffairs.gov.au/help-support/meeting-our-requirements/health/threats-to-public-health

[TaKinGDeePanal]

For starters, the "Never Again Trumpers" all seem to have disappeared. Add to that the following: 

Biden deciding to seek re-election despite promising to be a one-term POTUS;

Harris promising to do everything the same as Biden (even including perpetuating the assistance of genocide - refer below);

Trump's bolted-on 46-48% of the active voting population;

pro-Trump MSM/Russian social media disinformation;

the refusal to attempt to grow the Democratic voterbase;

Gaza (which we Kremlinologists know to be the Second Front of Ukraine);

a perceived economic health downward trend/COL issues;

the majority of the US voting public deciding that a black female was inferior to a white male;

voter intimidation, e.g., arson attacks on ballot boxes and bomb threats being called in to polling places; and

voter purges

and you start to get an idea of what happened. 

Edited yesterday at 10:44 AM by TaKinGDeePanal

[MuscledHorse]

22 hours ago, Poz50something said:

I also blame, to a certain extent, the ‘coronation’ of Kamala. I don’t think that Biden was unaware of his situation as his cancer diagnosis degraded and put him in a vulnerable position. I am convinced his chemotherapy was also responsible for the gaffs and the lack of energy. If the Dems had gone through the process of 12 candidates etc., it probably would’ve ended with Harris being the Democrat nominee. Then the rigorous process would have said to have worked. Of course, MAGAts are going to MAGA. 

They didn't have a choice at that point. It was poor chess playing from 2020, when they should have told Biden he was a one term president and started the next candidate planning then. When Biden was forced to step aside in mid 2024, Harris had to be the nominee or, under campaign finance law, they would have had to forfeit all the $$$ raised for the BIden Harris re-election campaign and start from nothing with only a few months before the election.  Harris was a terrible candidate and, like Palin before her, a poster child for what happens when you check boxes before qualifications. Hopefully by 2028, the Democrats will get themselves together, tell the small but vocally toxic super woke cancel culture crowd to sit down and shut up, no one likes them and they're driving away voters, and then bring some good candidates to the table (i,e. NOT Sanders or AOC).  Trump lost in 2020 largely because of his mishandling of COVD (as Clinton's campaign strategist James Carvel pointed out way back in 1992: people vote with their pocket books first and foremost with his famous "it's the economy, stupid!" retort to a reporter harping on social issues like gays in the military); plus the public was tired of Trump's exhausting three ring circus dumpster fire--only the ratings based profit driven mass media (that pretends at still being journalism) were all in for more Trump--and then 4 years later jonesing for the Trump-Biden rematch like this was HBO boxing done DC style). In a state like Georgia, where I am, Republicans won everything down ticket, save for Lofeller losing to Warnock, mainly because no one liked her from the moment she was appointed by the governor. Even David Perdue, who ultimately lost to Oseff in the Trump damaged runoff on Jan 6, received more votes in the general election than Trump did.  

[harrysmith25]

19 hours ago, BlindRawFucker1 said:

haErysmith,

 

”DO NOT” use the word “retarded!”

There is no excuse for that terminology.

You mean medical terminology?

How do you expect me to feel guilty about "marginalising" people when uh...
I'm marginalised myself, what with being a gay guy living in a Muslim country and all... seriously?

 

 

(Cue your next lame attempt to shut me up which I will also not be impressed by)
 

[PozBearWI]

14 hours ago, Poz50something said:

True, I am assuming. It’s a calculated guess. The majority of prostatic cancers are very slow growing, and I was making the calculations that he would have been told his cancer needed some kind of therapy, whether radiation therapy or chemo.

Now, I am not pulling this out of my tenderest nether regions. My sister was ill for quite some time, before she presented herself at the ER. She had breast cancer that had metastasised to her stomach and liver. I visited her twice, the last time three months before she died, and I saw how debilitating chemo was for my sister, and how she would be confused about details. So, yeah I am guessing, but it’s an educated guess. 

Indeed @Poz50something hopefully as we age we gain more direct experiences in ourselves and our associates in life.  

Whether Grandpa Joe (my affectionate reference for him) was getting chemo a year ago really doesn't matter.  It was always ill advised for him to attempt a second term.  I was disappointed he did that as it eliminated what I believe would have been valuable debate.  At the same time, I am disappointed there wasn't more of a challenge to that.  

I seem to be perpetually in the "vote for least worst" camp.  Coming to that conclusion can sometimes be a challenge.  For me I don't see any logic in voting Donnie back in; but obviously many did.  But now is the time to get deep into planning on "where to from here".

[kurbydog]

as an outsider looking in.   the US elections seem to boil down to who has the most money to spend.   The USA will always be an oligarcky, and not a democracy until there is very strict spending and donation controls.

Both the Democrates and the Republicans are far right wing parties compared to the rest of the world.

[harrysmith25]

On 5/29/2025 at 3:07 PM, Poz50something said:

I also blame, to a certain extent, the ‘coronation’ of Kamala. I don’t think that Biden was unaware of his situation as his cancer diagnosis degraded and put him in a vulnerable position. I am convinced his chemotherapy was also responsible for the gaffs and the lack of energy. If the Dems had gone through the process of 12 candidates etc., it probably would’ve ended with Harris being the Democrat nominee. Then the rigorous process would have said to have worked. Of course, MAGAts are going to MAGA. 

 

There haven't been words invented for what kind of lame "contributor" you are.

You remind me of like a bearded old guy in a comedic disaster movie who starts talking abstractly about "pressure zones" while everyone is trying to get into a basement,, or they're holding on as their trailer is blown into the sky.

No, not an "absent minded professor" cause you have nothing to profess. What the hell you are doing on a sex site, is one of the biggest mysteries!

[topblkmale]

2 hours ago, harrysmith25 said:

You mean medical terminology?

How do you expect me to feel guilty about "marginalising" people when uh...
I'm marginalised myself, what with being a gay guy living in a Muslim country and all... seriously?

 

 

(Cue your next lame attempt to shut me up which I will also not be impressed by)
 

 

Mind the rooftops.

 

[SomewhereonNeptune]

Ok, I know I said I'd take a leave from posting here. So I'm just giving the point of view of the mainstream America that voted for Trump and perhaps why by highlighting some of the issues and perhaps debunking others. Some of this is tongue-in-cheek, don't take it personally. 

On 5/28/2025 at 10:39 AM, harrysmith25 said:

to: "Them coming out and voting him back again". That one is still baffling me.

It's called "gaslighting". When the response to your logical arguments becomes "you're a racist", you eventually get tired of being forced into a corner when you know in your heart that you aren't. Especially when the arguments aren't about race or the responses have nothing to do with the original premise or point. Even a dog that's been kicked too much will attack its owner. The debate performance showed everyone with a working braincell that the media was gaslighting us about Biden's health.

5 hours ago, PozTalkAuthor said:

I fear that post-pandemic issues, and wars, have contributed relevantly. 
LGBT matters are not the issue, I think. They care for another kind of message: about migrants, and about economy.
The sensation I have, is that far-right gives a sense of safety, discipline, "we do what we promise".
I personally am against those DEI policies where they write and talk, place flags and messages around, pride-branded products, but then do less than nothing concretely.

No one truly has anything against any other faction or constituency. But people eventually get fatigued over being told they aren't tolerant or accepting when things like Pride or BLM continually come up. We all are very accepting of those ideals, but eventually people become fatigued from having it rammed down their throats. That or constantly being called "Nazis" when you actually understand the foundation of Naziism and can clearly link it to things like the anti-Semitic riots on college campuses where Jews are impeded from getting into facilities. Only thing missing there is wearing the yellow Star of David.

Border security was huge. It didn't take long to solve that issue despite being fed a diet of 'we'll need billions more dollars to solve that.' That was disproven quickly. Plus a lot was done, as we've since seen from the DOGE efforts, to break the bank on giving money to things that didn't make much sense to Americans. Then the immigration efforts. Imagine being an immigrant who went through the process legally, endured the hardships, and became a lawful citizen only to learn that so many of those coming through were sent to fully paid housing, financial stipends, and lots of other things not even given to American citizens, then to have that be glaringly in your face if you were in North Carolina and needed FEMA assistance only to learn that you're getting a measly $750 for having your house wiped out. That perception didn't sit well with Americans. 

4 hours ago, TaKinGDeePanal said:

Biden deciding to seek re-election despite promising to be a one-term POTUS;
Harris promising to do everything the same as Biden (even including perpetuating the assistance of genocide - refer below);
Trump's bolted-on 46-48% of the active voting population;
MSM/Russian social media disinformation;
the refusal to attempt to grow the Democratic voterbase;
Gaza (which we Kremlinologists know to be the Second Front of Ukraine);
a perceived economic health downward trend/COL issues;

Taking, there was a lot to unpack here so I focused on the items that actually resonated, many I didn't requote tend to be unproven or didn't make much difference. Things like "black female being inferior to a white male" or "voter intimidation"  or "Gaza being a second front of Ukraine" are wild conjecture, everything else I think we agree.

We didn't think a black female was inferior to a white male. We did think that this black female was the inferior candidate because she spoke in a word salad to people who would come away and think "Huh?" There's a difference in distinction. Plus many Democrats were upset with the lack of a primary process and not moving the nomination to the convention. Did the DNC really care what the voters wanted? Didn't seem that way. Check out Lindy Li who was a Democratic Strategist that walked away after the election and started siding more moderately. Her story is interesting.

Voter intimidation/voter purging. That's a subject near and dear to me since I and others went to court in NY over electoral fraud issues in a local election. Fraud happens. I could explain how states like NY do more to allow it while Florida clamps down hard on it, but I might as well put that in a blog under several parts. I know that local election commissions tend to get voters on the books and not do much to get them off, and that in most cases that generally benefits Democrats more than Republicans. Voter intimidation? That happened. In Philadelphia, where it was caught on video and well documented. If you really examined it, the incidence can be far likelier in 'blue' cities than in 'red' districts. Both Fulton County, Georgia and Maricopa County, Arizona had irregularities that came to light post-election. 

Things like the refusal to grow the voterbase and overall strategy worked to the benefit of Republicans, who grew their voterbase in more traditionally Democratic demographics. Young male adults. African Americans. Latino voters. The whole #WalkAway movement. All played a role as well. 

There are a lot of good thoughts here. And some stuff on both sides that might look like conspiracy theory through different lenses. MSM/Social Media disinformation was also a huge factor, and that's manifested in a distrust of the media. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out why Fox News and NewsMax are popular and MSNBC and CNN are waning, especially while Jake Tapper is now on his "sorry I lied for 4 years" tour. And I'm no fan of the do-nothing Republican Congress and Senate that have been disappointing AF in their inability to do anything, and the Democrats in both houses who supported many of these same measures in the past that Trump now supports turning tail and opposing them now thinking that's the hill they want to die on.  So both parties are a joke and we're all fucked. 

Hope this was entertaining. So I'll be like Biden and not take any questions as I stumble to find my way off stage. Peace! 🙂 

[SomewhereonNeptune]

49 minutes ago, kurbydog said:

as an outsider looking in.   the US elections seem to boil down to who has the most money to spend.   The USA will always be an oligarcky, and not a democracy until there is very strict spending and donation controls.

Both the Democrates and the Republicans are far right wing parties compared to the rest of the world.

Except that Harris spent $1.4 Billion and had a lackluster performance. And much of it was used to pay for celebrity endorsements like Beyonce and Oprah. Money put to good use? Nah.

[sluttony]

There has definitely been a shift within politics since Trump was first elected.

Back in 2016, I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt: he was a man not from a political background and even though he said a lot of questionable stuff, it was also a little refreshing to get actual answers to questions - if you look at politicians in the UK, they are experts at avoiding answering and it's hugely frustrating.

What happened next though was cut and dry demagogue behaviour.

The gaslighting. The outright lying. The self-serving.

What surprised me - and still surprises me - is the cult mind set of his followers:

• The leader is always right
• The leader must not be questioned
• Any questioning of the leader is heresy. 
• There must be no questioning that you are in a cult. It is not a cult - everyone else is just out to get us.
• And so on

But it's wider than this and was starting before this: look at the antivax movements or the chemtrails conspiracy theorists or the 5G signal conspiracies. You have grown damn adults who won't vaccinate their kids. Despite decades and decades of solid science. Because they think there's this global conspiracy - here's your <science based> degree, no sign this lifetime binding NDA to join the club of liars. Fuck me - Bill Clinton was alone in a room, in the White House with Monica Lewinski and the world got wind of that pretty damn quickly!

I do think it's down to a consistent lowering of educational standards. After all, the less educated are easier to manipulate and don't have the wherewithal to ask the tough questions (although look at Trump's record on that.. tough question / question he doesn't like? Attack the person asking...attack the outfit they work for... anything to divert attention from the actual topic).

Look at the tariff saga. Even now, a huge number of people in the USA believe that it's China or the EU that pay the tariffs... Vance calling out NATO and saying the USA can't count on them. The only time that NATO Article 5 has been invoked was after 9/11 when we all rushed to the USA's defence. And even then, the intelligence was a bunch of lies.

They behave like spoilt children and then wonder why Canada/EU/Australia want to also look inwards more. 

There's a reason why the rest of the world doesn't want US meat, or cars, for example - the meat is of terrible quality (nowhere else have I ever seen steaks listed as the best quality because they contain 89% meat...11% what, exactly?). They're full of growth hormones and water and other shit banned elsewhere. And your cars are terrible for our roads and smaller streets. Far far too big. And too thirsty.

You've been fed a constant stream of propaganda that USA is the best. Not even close in most cases.

The Democrats screwed the pooch with the election: You know they were running adverts towards the end of campaigning suggesting that women could vote for Kamala Harris with offensive taglines like "and you wouldn't even have to tell your husband!"

Way to patronise your prospective voters.

Then they just assumed "we've got the black vote in the bag with Kamala"

They should have worked to replace Biden much sooner. If they'd declared him medically unfit and replaced him 18-months to 2 years into his term, he'd have got sympathy. Instead they allowed him to say he would run again when he was clearly unfit.

They have pushed the trans rights type messages too far. They've alienated biological women by removing safe spaces, allowing men to compete in women's sports just by declaring they are now a woman.

They have supported allowing children to transition. 

They avoided targeting the things that actually would mean having a difficult conversation. 

And I do not understand the average mindset of an American around some other issues: This idea that you "don't want to pay for anyone else's healthcare" but this is precisely how insurance works - it spreads the risk so when someone uses it, it isn't the insurers paying, it's all of you. 

I was amazed, still, though, that so many of you voted a man back into power who lies, cheats, has a criminal record, has almost zero respect on the world stage, refuses to be accountable, etc etc.