"You clean ???" after the fact

[fillmyholeftl]

Just "my 2 cents". I was doing the testing/counseling @ Club Lauderdale last weekend (both Saturday Night & Sunday afternoon). When I'm there as a "patron of the club" I've had no problem getting raw cock & cum. thought actually, the last visit there, it was about half & half... I don't disclose, I have a BIOHAZARD Tat on my back for emphasis. I've gotten plenty of raw cock in the sauna, steam and video rooms with others watching. I think you were at a "bad night", quite possibly because of my being there "working"... we should've gotten together !

[Poz1956]

Fortunately, I met someone who gave me a bit of advice. Him being poz himself. He told me he never says he's poz if it's just oral. Even if it's anal if he's getting fucked, he won't say status. If he's fucking he will. And if a guy asks, "Are you clean" he doesn't even bother with a vague statement like that. He doesn't believe it's poz guys jobs to protect naive neggies.

I'm going to have to slightly disagree with your friend.

I think we Poz guys DO have some responsibility to protect the Neg guys. Being on ARVs and getting to a low viral load (ideally undetectable) IS being responsible, and IS protecting the Neg guys. I think the risk of my bottoming raw is also very low. I haven't gone there with a Neg guy yet, but I think I'm willing to do it. In my gut I still feel I should always disclose when doing it BB, but bottoming it's going to be a case by case decision.

For the moment I am not willing to cross the serostatus divide when topping raw. I know the risk is minimal, but it's still questionable enough that I'm not comfortable. Maybe when we see final results from the Partner and Opposites Attract studies I might change my mind. I suppose if there's full disclosure, and he still says "seed me" I'd go for it.

As for oral sex, I won't disclose either giving or receiving. Undetectable, there really is zero risk. Even with a high viral load, it's extremely low risk.

I just about went Nuclear when I saw the new provincial gay men's health website. In their piece on oral sex, they actually said there is a little bit of catching HIV for the guy RECEIVING a blow job!!!!!! On the Spit/Swallow question, the page said that it's impolite to cum in someone's mouth without asking. Was this written by a school marm? No discussion on spitting being higher risk than swallowing. The rest of that site is a useless waste of bandwith too. Clearly they didn't look at any other gay men's health site, or read the research about the kind of visuals and language are needed to engage gay men. Boy am I going to give them a piece of my mind.

Where I don't feel we bare responsibility is to always be the one who starts the conversation around status.

If guys are too scared to talk about HIV, to chicken to mention the word "status," how the hell can we get anywhere in combating it. If they can't even say the words, it's a pretty good bet that they aren't getting tested either. Too scared for testing, too stressed waiting for the outcome, and terrified of the results. "Clean" isn't a shield that provides any protection. There have been studies that showed a slight reduction in risk, as compared to no questions asked hook-ups. Other studies showed the opposite. That they increased the likelihood of exposure.

How do we educate people who can't even say HIV?

Edited May 2, 2014 by Poz1956

[fuckboy20]

Shit, I don't normally revive a thread...nor was I trying to.

@fuckboy20 - It's no surprise that you were turned down at Club LaLaDale. While I will admit it's like a beautiful gay resort with a bunch of hot guys, 98 percent of them when they hear POZ, that's it for them.

Slammers and Clubhouse2 are so much better for bareback sex - of all the times I was there, I was NEVER asked for status, guys took their raw cocks and shoved them up my ass and I did the same in return when I saw a willing bottom - in fact guys didn't even ask if they could cum, they all unloaded in my ass and I unloaded in any ass that I fucked as well.

POZ and Proud here - Condoms do break - and as I always say "If you play raw, you pay later" - Your being "HIV Negative" or "Clean" is determined at the NanoSecond of the blood draw. I know a guy who was tested one week at a clinic and three days later at this doctors - clinic was negative, doc was poz. He hadn't had anal sex in six months and the last time he did it was bareback. Goes to show, people that say they are neg may not be at all - just saying.

Haha. I love that. Club LaLaDale. It is a beautiful, amazing resort if you go for relaxing purposes. You're right, I don't know if they bb or not but hearing poz scares the shit out of them.

Yes they are. Even when I went two years ago a daddy top took me to his room and fucked and bred me multiple times. That was the first place I visited in Ft. Lauderdale. I wasn't really asked to be fucked by everyone nor if they could breed me. Same as the guy I fucked and bred. He was having trouble getting it up and when he got up to put his towel on, his ass looked sexy as hell. I just got hard, spit on my dick, and shoved it in. He didn't complain and I bred him too. And even a poz guy fucked me raw without really saying anything and said he was poz while fucking me. He didn't seem surprised when I told I already was.

Condoms do break you're right. A lot of guys say or think they're neg and don't know. When I was taking lots of raw cock if guys asked I'd just say, "Haven't been tested" or "Tested Neg a few months ago." That was all I could tell them.

Just "my 2 cents". I was doing the testing/counseling @ Club Lauderdale last weekend (both Saturday Night & Sunday afternoon). When I'm there as a "patron of the club" I've had no problem getting raw cock & cum. thought actually, the last visit there, it was about half & half... I don't disclose, I have a BIOHAZARD Tat on my back for emphasis. I've gotten plenty of raw cock in the sauna, steam and video rooms with others watching. I think you were at a "bad night", quite possibly because of my being there "working"... we should've gotten together !

Damn. Seriously? You do the testing and guys still fuck raw and breed? I've always felt that when testing goes on it's either one extreme or the others. Guys either are scared shitless to bb with pressure of guys being tested and maybe being poz or they say fuck it and go all bare. Flex has been like that at times. When there was testing there once everyone was playing safe. Well everyone I encountered. I wonder if I saw you. I was there saturday and sunday around 5 am. I think it was saturday..don't remember it was after 5 am or closer to 10. But I think I saw someone walking around with a biohazard tatoo. That got me thinking, especially after getting turned down by so many guys. "If I had a biohazard tatoo, wouldn't it be easier?" Don't know if it was you or not, but you seriously got me thinking about it. Uh, yeah we should have. I wasn't that organized on this trip to Ft. Lauderdale so I mostly played at the clubs but missed out on other opportunities. If I come back though, we will. There were some cute staff workers there too. One was cruising me . Well that and I was sort of thrown off by so many guys rejecting me from being poz. But I but if it was done without anything said, they'd do it. I got lots of guys that said, "Oh...you don't look poz."

I'm going to have to slightly disagree with your friend.

I think we Poz guys DO have some responsibility to protect the Neg guys. Being on ARVs and getting to a low viral load (ideally undetectable) IS being responsible, and IS protecting the Neg guys. I think the risk of my bottoming raw is also very low. I haven't gone there with a Neg guy yet, but I think I'm willing to do it. In my gut I still feel I should always disclose when doing it BB, but bottoming it's going to be a case by case decision.

For the moment I am not willing to cross the serostatus divide when topping raw. I know the risk is minimal, but it's still questionable enough that I'm not comfortable. Maybe when we see final results from the Partner and Opposites Attract studies I might change my mind. I suppose if there's full disclosure, and he still says "seed me" I'd go for it.

As for oral sex, I won't disclose either giving or receiving. Undetectable, there really is zero risk. Even with a high viral load, it's extremely low risk.

I just about went Nuclear when I saw the new provincial gay men's health website. In their piece on oral sex, they actually said there is a little bit of catching HIV for the guy RECEIVING a blow job!!!!!! On the Spit/Swallow question, the page said that it's impolite to cum in someone's mouth without asking. Was this written by a school marm? No discussion on spitting being higher risk than swallowing. The rest of that site is a useless waste of bandwith too. Clearly they didn't look at any other gay men's health site, or read the research about the kind of visuals and language are needed to engage gay men. Boy am I going to give them a piece of my mind.

Where I don't feel we bare responsibility is to always be the one who starts the conversation around status.

If guys are too scared to talk about HIV, to chicken to mention the word "status," how the hell can we get anywhere in combating it. If they can't even say the words, it's a pretty good bet that they aren't getting tested either. Too scared for testing, too stressed waiting for the outcome, and terrified of the results. "Clean" isn't a shield that provides any protection. There have been studies that showed a slight reduction in risk, as compared to no questions asked hook-ups. Other studies showed the opposite. That they increased the likelihood of exposure.

How do we educate people who can't even say HIV?

That's fine, I doubted it too for a minute. But then I thought of all the guys that rejected me and the fear of telling a really hot guy at a bar weeks ago that I was poz. It scared me into even talking to him for long. I just left.

I can agree with that stance. Being Undectable and being on meds is a way that helps the neggies. Even if they fuck up and take you raw or play with you from being drunk, horny, or I dunno human, they're more protected. I guess that means I'm not since I'm not on meds yet. Unfortunately certain situations and places I've lived and where I've been have tossed me back and forth so I haven't gotten the chance. But last my doctor told me my viral load wasn't too high and my cd4 was actually high. But yes, once I get tested again in May I will get on meds. I guess that means I'm a bastard right now fucking and sucking on both ends being completely untreated.

You did say though that you've had momentary judgement lapse and let a guy blow you or do something with a guy without saying your status. It was momentarily lapse of judgement and part of being human. You also stated that it's unfair that neg guys can get away with judgement lapse or just being human but poz guys have to act godly like and look after everyone and can't afford to fuck up or even be human. I told you that left an impression me.

I was in that situation once with a guy. We both were drunk and horny but i was using a condom to fuck him because he was neg. But he wanted it raw especially since I have trouble getting it up with a condom. And he wanted me to breed him to and I asked him if he was sure and knowing what it meant. And he wanted it so I gave it to him. But I'm sure people would still find that wrong. Contact was lost after that and I don't know if he's poz now or not, or if I'm the first that's done that to him. But even if I was, doesn't mean mine would necessarily infect him. I really hope I didn't. I don't blame you for having caution with topping someone even being undetectable. But with a poz guy, I'll fuck and seed him in a heartbeat.

Shit, was that a professional men's health website? Wow what a fucking joke. Impolite to cum in someone's mouth without asking? Fucking priceless. If someone ever said that I'd burst out laughing. No wonder so many people are confused with mixed/flawed information like that.

Conscious agrees with you. Although I'm sure half of the guys ran scared and maybe even went home it does make them think. "He said he's HIV? How many guys don't tell me their poz?". By not saying something or "masking it" then it doesn't really help anyone you're right. It's like being gay. Someone hiding being gay or the "Don't ask, don't tell" That doesn't help us in any way. It's probably the way it's talked about too. Showing fear, hesitation, or nervousness in telling someone you are poz or being timid about it will probably result in them being scared or shy about getting tested or asking others too. They'll think, "Oh god, it's such a painful thing to admit. Then it's probably painful for me to ask guys if they are neg or poz. It looks too hard, I won't do it."

I'll go back to you're perfect world segment again. In a perfect world meeting a guy and saying, "Oh hai I'm poz". Or when you are in bed with someone or before sex saying. "I'm HIV Positive but not full blown AIDS I'm undetectable on meds." with full strength, conviction, and confidence. Surely the confidence and strength shown will encourage the guy or sex partner to ask himself or do the same.

But in reality with fear, judgement, stigma, and self doubt this is nearly impossible to do for most guys. I would love to meet a man one day who can say his status without breaking a sweat and even being rejected still be confident and strong. Even being rejected by a string of men. If he could still stand tall after being rejected and not letting the rejection affect him personally then I'll do it too.

It's easy to say what the right thing to do is and what we should do, but the reality and the action of doing is much much more difficult. I'll even use another example. Gay couples holding hands in public. Some guys don't do it out of fear. Some guys do it and don't give a fuck what others think. But by not doing it because of fear, it's letting people define how they should behave in public despite what others do. By holding hands in public it shows strength, conviction, and not giving a shit what people think and knowing that it will piss people off. But it also makes them AWARE whether they want to be or not. Awareness is probably the key word.

Back to what you said before why is that poz guys have to be godly, why do we have to show now fear, hesitation, and have to carry the weight of the neggies. It's not entirely fair to ask, it's also not something everyone can do. But believe me, if I had the strength, morality, and courage to I would.

Could be partially because I'm young but having a guy fuck me raw without words spoken or fucking him raw and breeding him is just liberating. When I have sex I don't like to think of politics, issues or rights, stress, worries, fears, or anything. I just like to focus on the guy I'm with, the strength and virility I'm showing when I'm topping. Or when I'm bottoming, focusing on the guy and doing anything and everything I can to please him and show him my obedience, servitude, and eagerness. But as you've pointed out by being unmedicated, by not discussing or admitting status I'm not helping anyone. And it's probably a little selfish but in the RIGHT environment like cumunion or a bareback or poz event or location I don't want to. I just want to focus on sex, the smell of sex in the air, the atmosphere, and the guys, and the primal lust of the guys looking for sex and participating in sex.

But maybe in a more public place like a bar, event, or in more of the safer places I'd like to be more open and honest about my status and strong. I still remember when a guy at a bar in Atlanta went apeshit for me being honest about barebacking. And I defended myself fully and strongly, didn't hesitate or back down and told the guy it's my fucking life and my choices and they sure as hell won't affect him because I won't be doing anything with him. I don't know if people were listening or not, but regardless I showed my strength, conviction, and dedication to what I do and standing by it.

It's also partially because I'm still freshly poz you could say. I have all kinds of morals, ideas, dreams, expectations, hopes and worries. About sex, barebacking, poz, guys, and many other things. So I'm probably somewhat like a blank canvas, but I'll do my best to filter through good advice and bad advice and ultimately try to find the right combination that works for me and makes me who I am. But I'll admit, lately, and probably further down I'm sure it will be difficult especially figuring it out by myself. But I'm stubborn as hell. But I do respect your views poz1959, woods, and everyone else's. And while I won't let anyone control or dictate my life I still take suggestions, views, and ideas and see if they work for me or if I can make some sense out of them.

[wood]

I'm going to have to slightly disagree with your friend.

I think we Poz guys DO have some responsibility to protect the Neg guys. Being on ARVs and getting to a low viral load (ideally undetectable) IS being responsible, and IS protecting the Neg guys. I think the risk of my bottoming raw is also very low. I haven't gone there with a Neg guy yet, but I think I'm willing to do it. In my gut I still feel I should always disclose when doing it BB, but bottoming it's going to be a case by case decision.

For the moment I am not willing to cross the serostatus divide when topping raw. I know the risk is minimal.

Agree 100%, I dont think ANYTHING in sex should be one sided. With that said, undetectable HIV+ guys on meds deserve treatment, because they are protecting others by staying healthy. As I have said before I always believe in disclosure, but an undetectable bottom guy not saying anything when the top doesn't either? Ehh there is so little harm there I wouldn't care.

The one undetectable top/vers guy I am seeing right now was very hesitant at first to top me, I then explained PrEP and such and it put his mind at ease, but he still seems a bit nervous about it...which I am not, lol.

If guys are too scared to talk about HIV, to chicken to mention the word "status," how the hell can we get anywhere in combating it. If they can't even say the words, it's a pretty good bet that they aren't getting tested either. Too scared for testing, too stressed waiting for the outcome, and terrified of the results. "Clean" isn't a shield that provides any protection. There have been studies that showed a slight reduction in risk, as compared to no questions asked hook-ups. Other studies showed the opposite. That they increased the likelihood of exposure.

How do we educate people who can't even say HIV?

This is why I believe there needs to be mandatory testing, combined with education programs that are realistic, and not just about condom nazi's. All of the education programs now enforce the same message, If you slip up once it can ruin your life!!! It doesn't work, and what really doesn't work about it is that people will play raw a bit and be okay giving them a false sense of security, they then play raw with anyone who says "Im clean" or DDF here, until they test positive.

If they were more realistic and said stuff like; "yeah you probably wont get HIV the first time you have sex, or even the second time, but you may get warts which hurt like a bitch to get removed, so try and wrap it up. You may also want to consider PrEP if you are having sex with high risk people such as gay men, it reduces your chance of getting HIV even in cases of condom breakage or faliure to use. Get tested for HIV often, its quick and easy, and testing makes sure you and your partners are protected from HIV and other STI's.

obviously that's quite abridged, but instead of being confrontational an nagging, its just about basic stuff you can do to protect yourself.

[wood]

I was in that situation once with a guy. We both were drunk and horny but i was using a condom to fuck him because he was neg. But he wanted it raw especially since I have trouble getting it up with a condom. And he wanted me to breed him to and I asked him if he was sure and knowing what it meant. And he wanted it so I gave it to him. But I'm sure people would still find that wrong. Contact was lost after that and I don't know if he's poz now or not, or if I'm the first that's done that to him. But even if I was, doesn't mean mine would necessarily infect him. I really hope I didn't. I don't blame you for having caution with topping someone even being undetectable. But with a poz guy, I'll fuck and seed him in a heartbeat.

Did you tell him you were HIV+ If you did, then its no issue, there was consent. If you didnt tell him, or lied to him that's a whole other story.

[fuckboy20]

Did you tell him you were HIV+ If you did, then its no issue, there was consent. If you didnt tell him, or lied to him that's a whole other story.

Sorry I thought I made that clear. I told him I was poz. First time we met. We saw each other a few times before I actually fucked him. So he knew I was poz. That's why I asked him if he was sure (in the heat of the moment) if he wanted it raw and when I was fucking him raw if he really wanted me to shoot. We didn't talk about it after. That was probably the worst part. I was still kind of shocked (from the hot sex...and from the poz fuck and load) that I wasn't sure what to do or say. He just thanked me and enjoyed it and sent me on my way. And that's how we left it.

[Poz1956]

This is why I believe there needs to be mandatory testing, combined with education programs that are realistic, and not just about condom nazi's. All of the education programs now enforce the same message, If you slip up once it can ruin your life!!! It doesn't work, and what really doesn't work about it is that people will play raw a bit and be okay giving them a false sense of security, they then play raw with anyone who says "Im clean" or DDF here, until they test positive.

Mandatory testing is worse than laws that criminalize a Pozzie spitting.

People will go to extraordinary lengths to avoid mandatory testing. It would heighten the Stigma level to the outer reaches of the universe.

Look at how people try to avoid drug testing now -- carrying a bag of somebody else's wiz, with a hose under their dick. People will go to extraordinary lengths to avid testing. How well green cards have been at preventing undocumented immigrants from finding work?

Have you ever seen "Gattica?" A utopian/distopian future where parents select their children's genes, and people are judged by their genetic potential. Natural born children are shunned and only allowed menial jobs. Genetic purity tests are routine. It's a story about a guy made the old fashioned way, who bucks the system, and through a deal with a genetically pure but disabled man, manages to fool his way past all the tests. It's worth downloading.

HIV tests need more carrot than stick. If we could drive down Stigma, it might be possible. Hopefully final results from the Partner study, and Opposites Attract will give the Big Gun ammunition needed to do that. We must make testing NORMAL, and easy. Rapid tests at all clinics, so they don't stress waiting for the results. Make it something a person does for themselves -- their own health, and for their community. The people who haven't been tested in over six months should be frowned upon. While perhaps over the top, I picture something like the early days of China's one child policy. Women would ask each other "Have you had your pill today?" That's not unlike "When was your last test?"

But guys never ask when - only the results. Like I've said before, the new message needs to the "Testing, Testing, Testing" not "Condoms, Condoms, Condoms!"

Last night a guy wanted to hook up. He was professing about being disease free, and wanted to fuck me raw. I asked when was his last test. It was the classic "over over a year," but partially mitigated by only one fuck. He'd mostly done oral over that time.

I tried to defer to doing it safely. I finally gave up and came "clean" about my status. (See guys, I actually used that word in a correct context.) I told him all about the latest research, links to back it up. Of course he said "Ummm, I'll give it a pass tonight." It's a good thing I started the email repeating all the links, because he came back a short while later and blocked me. The email went through. Hopefully he'll at least read some of it. Yet another example that makes me think honest may not be the best policy.

I also have a 27 year old Bi guy harassing me about my having been Risky, Dangerous, and Stupid Stupid Stupid. Drive by shaming. Saw the status and just had to trash me. I retorted that I caught HIV before safe sex was invented. He came back with "How to Have Sex in an Epidemic" having been written in 1982, so I should have known better, and was therefore Stupid. I sent him back the copyright page from HHSE showing it had been published in May 1983, with an initial run of 5,000 copies. That was at least four months after my suroconversion symptoms. I doubt a single copy from that initial printing of HHSE ever made it to Calgary.

The "kid" is dishing me for something that happened five years before he was born! If he comes back again, I'll point out how Risky, Dangerous, and Stupid Stupid Stupid he's being for allowing his weight to reach the maximum you can post on the hook-up site. He'll probably be dead before he's my age.

In my very worst moments of anger, for a few seconds, I hope he becomes Poz. Of course I correct myself, and feel guilty for thinking it.

How do you fight against that kind of ignorance?

Edited May 3, 2014 by Poz1956

[bbzh]

Agree with your last post poz1956. No mandatory testing. It's a slippery slope that could be applied to other areas of one's life. As an individual I do have a right to privacy and your wish to know about my health does not trump my right to decide if I want to share it with you. I know plenty of people in the US who have missed out on getting jobs because of their credit history. Or because of what they are posting on Facebook. So what if a potential employer wanted to know if you were poz?

The story above about people trolling for raw sex but not wanting to really know if you are poz or neg is very real. So it's best to tell them what they want to hear. But throw in there that if they are really concerned, they should go get tested with a partner and stop relying on stupid lingo like DDF and clean. Guys will say whatever they need to for a fuck. The really honest ones are in the minority.

In an example of how tides are perhaps turning against the safe sex nazis, I was at a sex party in a sauna last night. The owner of the place has a deft strategy of giving the bare backers a wrist band so that they can easily identify who else wants to fuck raw. If you see a hot guy with no band, and you want to fuck raw, you pass him on by. And trust me, if you see another guy over in the corner with a bracelet taking loads, it attracts more loads. At one point I ended up in an area with 6 guys and we were drilling and seeding each other like crazy. It was so hot.

Edited May 4, 2014 by bbzh

[Guest JizzDumpWI]

Poke around here on breedingzone... Do you notice how many more are getting on PrEP and writing about it here? I think collectively WE are having an effect here. It seems as though other nations are giving energy to approving PrEP in their own countries (we've talked here before about why they persist in doing their own research - but the good news is, many are).

It would be interesting of rawTOP put in a survey about testing...

1. Your last test was (number) months ago or never.

2. Your last test was STI panel (including HIV) or just HIV?

3. How often do you (re)test?

[bearbandit]

Adding to Jizz's post, viral load and most recent CD4 (and percentage) should be added in: PrEP is only available freely in a few countries whereas TasP is the safest of drug regimes - in the UK while we want everyone's VL to be as low as possible, it's generally accepted that a three-figure (or fewer) VL is extremely unlikely to establish an infection. It was only a few years ago that 400 or even 500 was considered undetectable. Protection is a two way street; After all these years (34 for me) I'm convinced that the solution is drug based, not dependence on a flimsy piece of rubber. They were right for the time when there was no effective drug, but now when guys can go from a six figure VL to undetectable VL in a month, I'd put pills above the rubbers every time.

[Guest indynudeguy]

When I'm at the baths offering up my hole to any takers, I sure would feel foolish asking a guy his status after he drops his load in me.

[whoai]

Adding to Jizz's post, viral load and most recent CD4 (and percentage) should be added in: PrEP is only available freely in a few countries whereas TasP is the safest of drug regimes - in the UK while we want everyone's VL to be as low as possible, it's generally accepted that a three-figure (or fewer) VL is extremely unlikely to establish an infection. It was only a few years ago that 400 or even 500 was considered undetectable. Protection is a two way street; After all these years (34 for me) I'm convinced that the solution is drug based, not dependence on a flimsy piece of rubber. They were right for the time when there was no effective drug, but now when guys can go from a six figure VL to undetectable VL in a month, I'd put pills above the rubbers every time.

I just came across this post and wanted to chime in with my agreement. Behavior modification only goes so far when it's about denying yourself something pleasurable (bareback sex, high-carb food for a diabetic, etc.) Especially if the repercussions are not immediate or even only a percentage risk, people aren't good at changing behavior. Drug therapy, drug-based prevention, etc. will be the only way.

[Poz1956]

It's important to remember that pharmacological based prevention techniques are also behavioural based. It's as much a habit to take your ARVs or PrEP every day, as it is to put on a rubber.

All of the education programs now enforce the same message, If you slip up once it can ruin your life!!!

I have no problem with condoms being part of the strategy. They work well for some.

The lost child in the "condoms" message is PEP. While inappropriate in the context of BBing, it is important, when the messaging is around condoms. In other words, if they fuck up it won't ruin their life. I sort of like Sean Strub's idea of issuing three day "starter kits." They give guys a buffer, so they have time to make it through the administrative/insurance hassles of getting the other 25 days worth of drugs. Let's face it the broken condom, or "Oh Fuck, what did we just do" moments happen at 3:00 AM. Not exactly a time when you can easily call your doctor. And Hospital Emergency Departments / Urgent Care facilities are a zoo after bars close. Or maybe it's the next morning after some PnP, when there was a little more unwrapped penetration then he's planned. He brought the condoms -- they just didn't get used. Or after the wild night of drunken debauchery, taking any and all loads at the tubs. (Note, I'm talking about guys for whom condoms are the norm).

We know PEP works best if you start it ASAP. Having his own little three day supply means as soon as he has the clear headed "Oh Fuck" panic moment, he can pop the first pill.

A Washington DC HIV clinic, actually has a "red carpet" program for guys who want PEP. They get priority treatment, rush them in the door, counsel them, assess the risk and get them on treatment. PEP is featured prominently in most of the Australian prevention campaigns. They even have toll free(1-800) numbers to evaluate the risk, and direct you where to go. Bear will have to correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the UK has good PEP programs too.

A very few HIV service organizations are reality based enough to go beyond the "Condoms Only" model. The AIDS Committee of Toronto authored a piece titled Bareback Sex: What you need to know. ACT and the Gay Men's Sexual Health Alliance Produced a sex positive, non-judgemental website The Sex You Want.

Daily Xtra published an article For bareback, how to fuck more safely. (Xtra owns Squirt)

I've always been quite impressed with the campaigns from ACON (formerly the AIDS Council of NSW). they haven't shied away drugs, bareaback, and do good post-mortem analysis of each campaign. And they frequently include PEP. Their Know the Risk site is a visually appealing and information dense and a good example of what a gay men's health site should be. The Risk Calculator Includes viral load, and sero-positioning. If you drill down into the Q & A they are the first site I've seen that called undetectable Pozzies Low Risk. For an ASO - that's bold. And that was well before Partner came out.

Q: I did your risk calculator and it told me that as a negative bottom I was taking a "low risk" if my positive partner was on top, didn't use a condom, came inside me, but was undetectable. Are you fucking serious?

A: Are we serious? Yes we are. We base this strategy as a medium to low risk and this was based on research findings from both the HPTN052 and iprex studies, as well as consultation with research institutes here in NSW and clinical guidance and consultation from leading clinicians in the HIV field. They support the case for sustained (over more than 6 months) undetectable viral load (UDVL) offering a very significant protective benefit against HIV.

Positive Life NSW has great work as well. I liked their "SEX PIGS: Dark and dirty sex and managing your health" campaign on Adveturous Sex. The visuals with infoblurbs are great. It was produced from interviews with real guys. Ultimately it didn't go over well because people didn't perceive it as credible, because most pages mentioned condoms. Pigs & Condoms don't mix.

They learned from that and built the Wrapped or Raw campaign, with real people and videos.

Edited May 5, 2014 by Poz1956

[HardhatBB]

i luv it when they ask after they already got a huge load swimming around inside em

[Bottomhole]

I made a point of asking everyone I slept with if they knew their hiv status, if they had any sti's etc BEFORE I slept with them. It didn't help me in the end as I became positive anyway(although never had an sti other than that). But what a gopher to ask after the fact. And to word it "are you clean?" maybe he meant to ask had you showered. I never did the bathhouse thing(with the exception of once with a guy i met, but we just stayed with each other) because it'd seem silly to ask everyone their status.

 

Now that I'm positive I'd absolutely disclose before, I'd feel awful if I was to pass my infection on to anyone else, which will probably kill any chance I had of getting a girlfriend.