Infector Dies Of Aids

[cam1972]

I hope I'm posting this in the right forum. I was diagnosed in 2007 with HIV. I had had a fuck buddy with which I had regular sex. Always bareback. I knew he fucked other guys and that was ok. We weren't in a relationship. When I was diagnosed, I told him he needed to get tested. He said "Nah. I'm good. I don't have it." I told him to get tested several times over the course of several months, and he said that he didn't have it. He was so adament about it that he quit talking to me. So I assumed I had been infected by someone else.... I had cancer in 2009 and in 2010, he text messaged me and said he had cancer.He was a facebook friend and had seen that I had had it. He was the type that if someone had an illness, then he had it. So I didn't take him seriously. But I did wish him well. Never heard from him again. Last year. I became curious as to what happened to him. So I tried hitting him up on messenger. He never responded. I googled him. Found his dad's obituary but nothing else. Waited a couple of months then googled him again. Saw the link to the obituary again, so I thought I'd check it out this time. It wasn't his dad's obit. It was his. He died in 2011. I figured it was cancer. Two weeks ago, I was on A4A talking to a guy from his town. I asked if he had known him and he said "Yes. But don't worry. I've been tested." I asked what he meant. He told me that he had died of AIDS. By the time he was diagnosed, he was past medical treatment. It hit me llke a ton of bricks. I keep saying over and over to myself "If he would have just listened to me and been tested, he'd still be here." And....... Now I know for sure who infected me. I know there are older guys on here who saw a lot of friends die when it was an epidemic. But... Has this happened to anyone else? And... How do you move past the wishing they would have listened? He's been gone for four years, yet I feel like he just died... I know this is a strange post, but.... I'm having a hard time processing it for some reason...

[barehole4use]

I know someone exactly like this who refuses to get tested & avoids the whole subject if i bring it up, So honestly my thoughts are if you ever die then it's your own stupid fault. Personally guys should take responsibility for there own health.

[bottombehr]

Cam1972 you have my sympathy for the loss of your friend. Barehole4use is correct each person is responsible for their own health.

[Bottomhole]

Sorry to hear that cam1972. There is no right way to process things, that's something I learned when I was diagnosed myself. From what I gather you went out of your way to try to help that man, more than you needed to. It was his own responsibility but I'm sure that doesn't help with the feeling your getting, even if you believed that. I have also very recently learned, the best way(for me) to process things and get past them, is to talk out loud with someone close. I'm usually hesitant to do this as I can feel embarrassed or even not know what to say, but once I do talk about things I tent to be able to move past them better. This is probably of no help, but my sympathies are with you, from your posts on this over the years, you seem like one of the more genuine and thoughtful people on BZ. So good luck. 

[Guest]

I have no clue who infected me, because I took lots of loads from guys with AIDS in the early 80s. (There was no HIV test then, so getting tested was not an issue.) Many of them were regular fuck buds at the baths, including some who fucked me only a few weeks or so before they died. I'm grateful that we shared mutual pleasure in their last days, and I'm proud to be alive and healthy and to carry their DNA today.

[cam1972]

Sorry to hear that cam1972. There is no right way to process things, that's something I learned when I was diagnosed myself. From what I gather you went out of your way to try to help that man, more than you needed to. It was his own responsibility but I'm sure that doesn't help with the feeling your getting, even if you believed that. I have also very recently learned, the best way(for me) to process things and get past them, is to talk out loud with someone close. I'm usually hesitant to do this as I can feel embarrassed or even not know what to say, but once I do talk about things I tent to be able to move past them better. This is probably of no help, but my sympathies are with you, from your posts on this over the years, you seem like one of the more genuine and thoughtful people on BZ. So good luck. 

I appreciate your comments. It's very difficult to find someone to talk to vocally about this where I live. I'm in a small town where there are few gay men. And most of them are closeted. The very letters HIV or AIDS sends the rest of them back into the closet. But I hope to find someone to talk to about this. I've long since accepted having HIV. I don't think about it. Not even when I'm taking my meds. But this.... I think it's going to take some time to accept. I'll get there someday. Just like I did with having HIV.

[Bttm2go]

I have known two guys that died because they did not feel they needed to be tested. One was very close to me. It sucks that they did not want to listen, but it is their life. You tried to help him and he did not listen. You did everything you could. I'm still dealing with the death of my good friend so I know it takes awhile to get past it.

[BearOKC69_Poz]

While he may have been gone for 4 years, you just found out...so from your perspective, he did just die...it will take time...as suggested find somesort of support group or individual you can talk freely about it...it does help to verbalize and get things out...maybe visit his grave...right a letter to him...then burn it and throw the ashes to the wind..just some thoughts...no answers as processing it is a different journey for everyone...peace

[AlwaysOpen]

Just read this post, and  ironically, our local NPR ( Natl Public Radio  for those non-USA based guys) station had a guest on yesterday who wrote a book about the whole grieving process--of course, I was driving to work and only caught a bit of it--but the truth she spoke was this : Grief  takes hold, and  ignoring it  or fighting it is pointless--it will hang on until you  allow it to process out. She suggested  allowing grief to take a seat at the table with you- to let it  run its course much like a cold or flu- and to push thru as it gets easier to deal with  it, and resume your own life. I don't know if it  will get thru, but the NPR station here is WLRN,it is an ORG URL, and the air date was 15 Jun in the Topic Currents talk section. The author, and book title , is  below ( again, not sure if  it will get thru, or if a filter bot will block it)  CAM, you did what you  thought was right at the time-you urged  your friend to  seek care,he chose not to. Undoubtedly, he knew his status long before you  got infected, and was either unconcerned about YOUR health and life, or his- or both. You showed caring and concern, and are still on the Earth today thanks to it.  Use these days to live, and don't linger too long on looking back. 

The book-- 

Grief Specialist Claire Bidwell Smith: "When Life is Over, Where Do We Go?"

[AlwaysOpen]

BTW-- to all-- if you have taken the precautions and  did the planning for your health care in  future days towards the end of your life--not particularly an end of your life from ANY virus or illness- but in the known fact we will ALL expire one day--  if you have appointed a friend or family member to act as your power of attorney for health care {POA}-- PLEASE do them a huge favor-- they will be the person the medical staff will turn to to decide end of life care for you ( such as hospice care with only palliative care ( which means pain meds but no food or water until death occurs)  Now, while you are well and have a sound head- come up with a really wrong question  for your POA to ask you when the day comes--something  such as" Wasn't Ms Kitty  your favorite hedgehog?"  when in fact you never had a hedgehog as a pet-- this will be a coded  conversation between you and that person- when you  are asked, you know the end is near; the person you have put all faith in is having to make some very  hard decisions on your behalf, and when you answer YES!!, it will let him know you are aware; you support his decision, and YOU can  begin your own process of saying goodbye. Often, esp with  gay men, family may not want to let go and might even resent the suggestion-or be unwilling to hear the words yet- but the coded question is known to the 2 involved. AND- the person making  the life ending decisions  for the ailing person will have the mental relief after death occurs of knowing the dying knew and more importantly agreed to the choices being made. 

BTW part 2--if you have not done power of attorney, wills, do not resuscitate orders,  and the like yet--do it now--NO one has ever lived forever--and damned few people knew exactly when and where they would die. 

Now, enough about death- everyone should be out fucking  and living TODAY.. but do get things in order for those left picking up your dirty jocks  long after you have gone

[TigerMilner]

I just finished watching the 1993 film Philadelphia with Tom Hanks. What a sad movie. It has me remembering the 80s and 90s and thinking about all the friends and lovers I lost back then. I used to wonder why I was spared. I mean it took nearly 30 years for me to get HIV.  I used to think I deserved it. I was just thinking how lucky we are to be living today when we have Antiretrovirals to keep the virus from killing us. It was horrible in the 80s. Back then it was an "AIDS test".  And if you tested positive, well, you knew most likely you were going to die. Some guys survived it, most did not.

 

A couple of years ago I knew of a handsome 25 year old guy who was rushed to the emergency room with difficulty breathing. He never left the hospital and died of AIDS three weeks later. He had never been tested. He was a PnP guy and as good looking as he was there is no telling how many men he unknowingly infected. The doctors said as advanced as the KS that was blocking his airways was that he had probably been positive 8-9 years. This happened in 2011. Not 1995. People still die of AIDS but only if they are not tested and not on meds.

 

I have had to deal with a lot of loss due to this bastard of a disease so I know how you feel. Watching this movie tonight drug it all back up so I am relieved to have your post to respond to in order to let some of it out. Yeah I've moved on, but I'm not sure we ever totally get over this kind of loss. It may sound weird, but I am very happy that I know who infected me and that we are still friends. More importantly I'm happy he and I are not going to die-at least not of this. Most guys don't know who infected them, so consider yourself lucky. I do.

Edited June 16, 2015 by TigerMilner

[Fealie]

Once you have figured that out that is correct each person is responsible for their own health. there are so many options.. 

[wood]

I just finished watching the 1993 film Philadelphia with Tom Hanks. What a sad movie. It has me remembering the 80s and 90s and thinking about all the friends and lovers I lost back then. I used to wonder why I was spared. I mean it took nearly 30 years for me to get HIV.  I used to think I deserved it. I was just thinking how lucky we are to be living today when we have Antiretrovirals to keep the virus from killing us. It was horrible in the 80s. Back then it was an "AIDS test".  And if you tested positive, well, you knew most likely you were going to die. Some guys survived it, most did not.

 

A couple of years ago I knew of a handsome 25 year old guy who was rushed to the emergency room with difficulty breathing. He never left the hospital and died of AIDS three weeks later. He had never been tested. He was a PnP guy and as good looking as he was there is no telling how many men he unknowingly infected. The doctors said as advanced as the KS that was blocking his airways was that he had probably been positive 8-9 years. This happened in 2011. Not 1995. People still die of AIDS but only if they are not tested and not on meds.

 

I have had to deal with a lot of loss due to this bastard of a disease so I know how you feel. Watching this movie tonight drug it all back up so I am relieved to have your post to respond to in order to let some of it out. Yeah I've moved on, but I'm not sure we ever totally get over this kind of loss. It may sound weird, but I am very happy that I know who infected me and that we are still friends. More importantly I'm happy he and I are not going to die-at least not of this. Most guys don't know who infected them, so consider yourself lucky. I do.

For some reason movies like Philadelphia, And the Band played On, etc never really bothered me, yet they were all incredibly thought provoking.  To me they serve as great learning tools to show what can happen, and what a good response should be to a crisis.  I think that what happens today is that many guys just don't want to confront reality.  They enjoy their "Peter Pan" worlds, whatever they may be.  

 

Tiger, I had a similar acquaintance die in 2012. In his case, he had been sick on and off for years, and when he wasn't working he was sleeping.  He never went to the doctor until his mother physically came and dragged him out of his apartment to the ER.  Well at 27, He had AIDS, no immune system, and a brain tumor.  He was in the hospital about a month before he passed.  

 

This bring us back to the topic, of "unmedicated, high vl, etc" and to a certain extent bug chasing.  Dying from AIDS is a horrible death no matter what, but if you are in a first world nation today its almost completely preventable.  While they may be scared, There is no reason people in this day and age should die of AIDS, and infect others along the way.        

[seaguy]

knowledge is power so people should get tested.  Sadly this shows what can happen when one does not get tested.

[cam1972]

I just finished watching the 1993 film Philadelphia with Tom Hanks. What a sad movie. It has me remembering the 80s and 90s and thinking about all the friends and lovers I lost back then. I used to wonder why I was spared. I mean it took nearly 30 years for me to get HIV.  I used to think I deserved it. I was just thinking how lucky we are to be living today when we have Antiretrovirals to keep the virus from killing us. It was horrible in the 80s. Back then it was an "AIDS test".  And if you tested positive, well, you knew most likely you were going to die. Some guys survived it, most did not.

 

A couple of years ago I knew of a handsome 25 year old guy who was rushed to the emergency room with difficulty breathing. He never left the hospital and died of AIDS three weeks later. He had never been tested. He was a PnP guy and as good looking as he was there is no telling how many men he unknowingly infected. The doctors said as advanced as the KS that was blocking his airways was that he had probably been positive 8-9 years. This happened in 2011. Not 1995. People still die of AIDS but only if they are not tested and not on meds.

 

I have had to deal with a lot of loss due to this bastard of a disease so I know how you feel. Watching this movie tonight drug it all back up so I am relieved to have your post to respond to in order to let some of it out. Yeah I've moved on, but I'm not sure we ever totally get over this kind of loss. It may sound weird, but I am very happy that I know who infected me and that we are still friends. More importantly I'm happy he and I are not going to die-at least not of this. Most guys don't know who infected them, so consider yourself lucky. I do.

I am not a very emotional man. Jaded might describe me. But this post.... Hit me. I was in high school in the 80's. Wasn't having sex with men. But I heard about AIDS on the news a lot. I know the difficulty I'm having with losing one friend... I can't imagine losing like you did.

 

It is, in some way, a relief to actually know who infected me. For certain. Thanks for posting, Tiger. I appreciate what you had to say.