What are the actual definitions of gay top, bottom and versatile?

[NWUSHorny]

It seems to me that there is some significant variation in how guys on the hookup apps are interpreting this, and not just the "sides", where there doesn't seem to be any kind of agreement on whether being a "side" includes oral.

I was just checking out the attendees for tomorrow nights Cumunion party on BBRT, and one "versatile" looks very promising until I read what he wrote, "I consider myself verse, take cock and use my mouth, fist and toys on a hole," unfortunately I would consider him to be a bottom, not even close to versatile.

I should probably just stay off the hookup apps completely while I'm in the PNW.

Edited January 19, 2023 by drscorpio
Fixed typo as per message below

[hungry_hole]

49 minutes ago, NWUSHorny said:

significant variation

Identities are ambiguous and people interpret those identities in different ways. I've even seen alternative explanation that defines a man to be gay only if he falls in lave with other men. According to this guy having sex with men didn't make a man gay.

Bottom, top and versatile are also "identities" and in this case too, people will have different understanding of the differences. I prefer to focus on the "needs" because those are real and unambiguous. I've written about this before where I explain that the preferred role of a guy will depend on a few variables, some of them quite obvious.

If a guy has a difficult time getting a hard-on, problems maintaining it, and cums too quickly he's not a good candidate for a top. In terms of bottoming, many guys still associate bottoming as the "female" role and therefore have a problem assuming the bottom role. Other guys cannot bottom because they find it invasive and it requires relaxation.

When in was in my 20's I had a gay friend who was a bottom and he was very open with me about his adventures in saunas. I could understand the simple enjoyment of topping, the sensation of the friction on the cock, and then the orgasm, but from listening to my friend, the pleasure of bottoming seemed to be more sophisticated.

 

 

[BootmanLA]

1 hour ago, NWUSHorny said:

one "versatile" looks very promising until I read what he wrote, "I consider myself verse, take cock and use my mouth, fist and toys on a hole," unfortunately I would not consider him to be a bottom, not even close to versatile.

You say you wouldn't consider him a bottom or a versatile. However, he says he takes cock, but only uses "mouth, fist, and toys" on a hole. To me, that signifies the reverse; that he IS primarily a bottom, but willing to other things (besides fucking) with another bottom. What he does NOT seem to be is a top, as he makes no mention of using his cock at all.

[NWUSHorny]

1 hour ago, BootmanLA said:

You say you wouldn't consider him a bottom or a versatile. However, he says he takes cock, but only uses "mouth, fist, and toys" on a hole. To me, that signifies the reverse; that he IS primarily a bottom, but willing to other things (besides fucking) with another bottom. What he does NOT seem to be is a top, as he makes no mention of using his cock at all.

That is a typo, it should have read, unfortunately I would consider him to be a bottom, not even close to versatile.

He is most definitely not versatile, or a top. On the other hand guys here bring dildos to the bathhouses here, and post hookup ads to play dildos.

[hntnhole]

It seems that a lot of guys have gradually altered what used to be fairly clear definitions:

1.  "Top" means (or used to) a guy who will only fuck.  Active only, nothing passive.

2.  "bottom" means (or used to) mean a guy who will only get fucked.  Passive only, noting active.  

3.  "Verse" means (or used to) a guy that potentially will both Top and/or bottom, depending on the scene.  

When the above turns into an alphabet soup, the meanings are rendered moot. 

Point:  Less talk, more Breeding.  Less endless time-wasting on the cruise apps, go to where the pigs are, shuck your jeans and jump in.  

[ErosWired]

From the way you have frequently described men’s approach to sexual practice in the PNW, it sounds as though ‘versatile’ has evolved a new meaning signifying “among the several non-fucking things we do, I do a number of them”. The guy you reference may consider himself ‘versatile’ because he’s good with both toys and fisting. He might also consider himself versatile because he’s willing to penetrate a hole with a toy or fist, where a bottom doesn’t penetrate at all.

[NWUSHorny]

It almost seems like the hookup apps need to take the initiative and create a list of questions to determine what a posters position is, BBRT already has questions on whether you give or take loads for both anal and oral. It would probably look something like this:

NOTE: If you only perform an activity with someone you know, and not with someone you just met online or while cruising you should answer no to the question for the purposes of this hookup app.

1) Do you engage in anal sex with online hookups or in cruising situation?

1a) Will you penetrate an anus with your penis?

1b) Will you allow your anus to be penetrated with a penis?

NOTE: If you answered no to both 1a and 1b you do not have an oral sex position.

2) Do you engage in oral sex with online hookup?

2a) Will you insert your penis into someone's mouth?

2b) Will you allow a penis to be inserted into your mouth?

NOTE: If you answered no to both 1a and 1b you do not have an anal sex position

NOTE: If you answered no to 1a, 1b, 2a and 2b, you are a "side" please list your desired activities.

 

[NWUSHorny]

1 hour ago, ErosWired said:

From the way you have frequently described men’s approach to sexual practice in the PNW, it sounds as though ‘versatile’ has evolved a new meaning signifying “among the several non-fucking things we do, I do a number of them”. The guy you reference may consider himself ‘versatile’ because he’s good with both toys and fisting. He might also consider himself versatile because he’s willing to penetrate a hole with a toy or fist, where a bottom doesn’t penetrate at all.

I know I'm being snarky, but if that is the case, it seems to me that he might fit in better at the other bathhouse's regularly scheduled "Toy Box Thursday" (dildo play date), than go to the Cumunion Party tonight. He could even get a discount rate for showing them his dildo(s) when he checks in at dildo play date.

[hntnhole]

1.    I would, but I don't use them anymore.

1a.  Of course.

1b.  Almost never.

2.   I might, but I don't use them anymore.

2a.  Of course.

2b.  Maybe, but in the fuckjoints.  

So, if this mean's I'm some guy's "side", I haven't met him yet.

[NWUSHorny]

15 hours ago, hntnhole said:

It seems that a lot of guys have gradually altered what used to be fairly clear definitions:

1.  "Top" means (or used to) a guy who will only fuck.  Active only, nothing passive.

2.  "bottom" means (or used to) mean a guy who will only get fucked.  Passive only, noting active.  

3.  "Verse" means (or used to) a guy that potentially will both Top and/or bottom, depending on the scene.  

When the above turns into an alphabet soup, the meanings are rendered moot. 

Point:  Less talk, more Breeding.  Less endless time-wasting on the cruise apps, go to where the pigs are, shuck your jeans and jump in.  

It is pretty simple for me to answer, I'm versatile. As long as there is mutual attraction and the other party isn't "functionally lesbian" we can fuck.

Unfortunately we have the same problem at the in person hookup spots as we do on the apps,

[NWUSHorny]

4 minutes ago, hntnhole said:

So, if this mean's I'm some guy's "side", I haven't met him yet.

Unfortunately "side" has been completely preempted by the guy where, "you can lead the dick to the hole, or the hole to the dick, but you can't make him fuck." I'm just as happy if they identify themselves that way up front. Maybe I can get them to wear a scarlet "S" on their foreheads in the fuckjoints and cruising spots, so I don't have to waste my time with them.

[BlindRawFucker1]

There are profiles on BBRT, which say “BTM”, but they don’t take dick orally or anally.  What’s that about?

 

I’m totally confused, or they don’t understand the classifications.

 

Now, I’m going to ask a possibly stupid question.  What’s a “side?”

[ErosWired]

2 hours ago, NWUSHorny said:

Maybe I can get them to wear a scarlet "S" on their foreheads in the fuckjoints and cruising spots, so I don't have to waste my time with them.

A while back someone here suggested that people wear those rubber wristbands in different colors to indicate role - Top, bottom, vers, etc. It would be simple enough to add an additional color for ‘side’. Maybe beige or mauve or some other nondescript, noncommittal, unadventurous hue.

The trouble with the wristband idea, though, is that you’d inevitably end up with guys wearing multiple bands, thereby defeating the whole purpose.

[NWUSHorny]

1 hour ago, ErosWired said:

A while back someone here suggested that people wear those rubber wristbands in different colors to indicate role - Top, bottom, vers, etc. It would be simple enough to add an additional color for ‘side’. Maybe beige or mauve or some other nondescript, noncommittal, unadventurous hue.

The trouble with the wristband idea, though, is that you’d inevitably end up with guys wearing multiple bands, thereby defeating the whole purpose.

The bathhouse hosting tonight's Cumunion, already has 2 parties a month where they issue glow stick wristbands by position. They already have colors for top, bottom, versatile, oral and none of the above and I hear complaints that just 5 options is inadequate. Maybe, I am starting to see their point since this guy probably picks the versatile wristband, even though he is really a bottom. Before now I thought they were upset that there was no options for cuddlers or tit play, which are both popular bathhouse activities here. To be fair 75-80% are selecting the oral and none of the above hues, so maybe they have a point about the number of options being inadequate even if you take the loose interpretation of versatile out of the equation.

Edited January 19, 2023 by NWUSHorny

[NWUSHorny]

1 hour ago, BlindRawFucker1 said:

Now, I’m going to ask a possibly stupid question.  What’s a “side?”

"Side" seems to be becoming the accepted term for guys who neither give or take dick. There is some debate about whether guys who only do oral should be included in the "side" classification since there is a large number that don't even participate in oral.

I'm still waiting for a definition of "power cuddler", that was the hot self descriptor for BBRT profiles that don't fuck a few months ago in my area.