How do you know?

[tighthole64]

It's common knowledge that many guys avoid doctors before and once pozzed as they will end up being reported and questioned by the health department, and being lectured by the doctor on starting meds.  It's simple enough to do a homebm test to determine if poz, but after that how does one determine if he has HIV, or has reached Aids status?

I havevl been chatting with someone who THINKS he's reached AIDS status, but not truly sure.  Based on what I know about him, I feel like he does, that he has reached it.  

Either way, I'd truly like him to be the one to infect me.  As this is somewhat personal between us, I asked that he respond privately than in an open forum  

[viking8x6]

1 hour ago, tighthole64 said:

It's common knowledge that many guys avoid doctors before and once pozzed as they will end up being reported and questioned by the health department, and being lectured by the doctor on starting meds. 

Stating this as "common knowledge" about "many" guys without specifying any numbers is bad argument, and does nothing constructive to support your actual question.

1 hour ago, tighthole64 said:

It's simple enough to do a homebm test to determine if poz, but after that how does one determine if he has HIV, or has reached Aids status?

If he has seroconverted (i.e. he is poz), he has HIV. As far as I know there is no other way to get antibodies for it, decades of research into effective vaccines notwithstanding.

AIDS status is defined based on a quantitative level of CD4 cells (requires a blood test to find out) or the development of certain opportunistic infections (to be definite, requires a doctor's diagnosis). So you literally can't really know for sure without talking to a doctor - AIDS is an arbitrary dividing line based on particular medical evidence.

[austin_submale]

I have to agree with viking8x6 on most of his points.  I don't know that it is common knowledge at all that many guys avoid doctors, or if they do if it is mostly due to the reasons you suggest.  The fact that there are so many UD+ guys would suggest the opposite actually.

As I understand it, whether he has crossed the line into being at "full blown" AIDS or not really has not that much to do with how likely you will be to be infected.  From what I've read the highest VL levels are usually not that long after someone converts, then they go down and may go back up again when someone reaches the "AIDS" status, but I'm under the impression often not always nearly as high as in the initial stages.

But I'm not a Doctor and don't even play one on TV...  and if you really want to know whether he is Poz, then the home tests will work, but if you want to know what his VL and CD4 are, as viking says...  gotta have a professional blood test.  Or also as he says presence of some other infections or diseases (like Kaposi's Sarcoma), but he's also correct that it still requires a doctor's diagnosis.

 

[Theo8]

No one from the health department contacted me after I was diagnosed.  This was back in the late 90s and in West Virginia.  Maybe they didn't have a reporting protocol in place back then.  

[ytowndaddybear]

Planned Parenthood offers free anonymous HIV and STD testing.   If you visit a location outside of your home state it gets reported to the health department there, not where you live.

[BootmanLA]

Broadly speaking, health care providers in the U.S. do NOT have the right to share your health records, including the results of any HIV test, with anyone without your consent. There are exceptions for sharing within a given health care provider, and of course a doctor treating you is going to seek a release to allow him or her to share your records, as needed, with places like labs where your bloodwork is sent. And there is an exception where the law requires disclosure to protect public health - but that's not designed as a hole to drive trucks through.

In fact, keeping HIV/AIDS diagnoses confidential was one of the reasons (though not the only) that HIPAA exists in the first place. Prior to it, there were a hodgepodge of state laws that protected some, but not all, medical information, and many states and localities were routinely sharing info about HIV+ persons under the guise that it was a health emergency. HIPAA was designed to provide some uniformity to that privacy right.

[austin_submale]

12 hours ago, ytowndaddybear said:

Planned Parenthood offers free anonymous HIV and STD testing.   If you visit a location outside of your home state it gets reported to the health department there, not where you live.

I've heard back in the day that the health departments would actually try to contact people who got certain diseases...  HIV, syph, etc...  But I thought that went away years ago.

 

[austin_submale]

1 hour ago, BootmanLA said:

Broadly speaking, health care providers in the U.S. do NOT have the right to share your health records, including the results of any HIV test, with anyone without your consent. There are exceptions for sharing within a given health care provider, and of course a doctor treating you is going to seek a release to allow him or her to share your records, as needed, with places like labs where your bloodwork is sent. And there is an exception where the law requires disclosure to protect public health - but that's not designed as a hole to drive trucks through.

In fact, keeping HIV/AIDS diagnoses confidential was one of the reasons (though not the only) that HIPAA exists in the first place. Prior to it, there were a hodgepodge of state laws that protected some, but not all, medical information, and many states and localities were routinely sharing info about HIV+ persons under the guise that it was a health emergency. HIPAA was designed to provide some uniformity to that privacy right.

I wasn't aware that it was that closely related specifically to HIV, but I suppose timing wise it makes sense.  The over-reach and intrusion by health boards and other gov't agencies back in the day was pretty bad.  And it reared it's head again some during this whole Covid mess, but I suppose without HIPAA it probably would have been worse.

[mpjockstrap]

Ok.  Some knowledge.  Not that there isn't good information here already but here's some need-to-know.

HIV is, in the virology world, what is known as a BSL-2/3 (Bio Safety Level 2/3) infectious agent.  Under certain circumstances, virus samples (such as infected blood) are handled at BSL-2 containment levels.  If, however, the samples are concentrated, in production, etc...then it's treated as a BSL-3 agent.  Some examples of BSL-3 are Anthrax, Brucella abortus (causes Brucellosis), plague, Q Fever, and Tularemia, all of which occur naturally...and are first-choice biological warfare agents.  If there is a chance the sample becomes airborne (yes, it happens), then HIV becomes a BSL-3 infectious agent.  Same as weapons-grade bubonic plague or Anthrax.

HIV is a reportable disease in every state; it's law, if you test, whoever you test with absolutely WILL report to state public health officials that a sample has popped positive in such and such location.  That factoid goes into a secure database (Illinois treats their HIV office like what's behind the door are the nuclear codes) and gets filed away.  If, at some point, an epidemiologist finds a need to come knocking, they already talked to your provider, cleared the visit legally, and are now asking you questions to map the spread or develop a data picture.

They are NOT going to call your boss or your mother.

They ARE treating it like the public health threat it is, as the men (and others) who survived the 80's and 90's will attest.  Drugs do wonders, do not work for everyone, and may lose efficacy over time   We got PreP and the current slate of anti-retrovirals from, among other things, epidemiological study...one day, hopefully, a wide-spectrum vaccine will come to us and the little bastard can be eradicated from nature like rinderpest and smallpox.

Until then, to public health officials and virology, HIV is roughly the same, at it's worst, as Anthrax.  So keep that in mind, it's based on the characteristics of the infectious agent, not on the populations it uses as a reservoir.

Before you ask, yes, I used to work, a long long time ago, in Nuclear, Biological, Chemical, and Radiological (NBC-R) Warfare Defense.  

Edited March 28, 2023 by mpjockstrap

[mpjockstrap]

12 hours ago, austin_submale said:

I've heard back in the day that the health departments would actually try to contact people who got certain diseases...  HIV, syph, etc...  But I thought that went away years ago.

 

No.  It never went away.  They aren't puritans trying to steer people to God, they don't care usually.  They want to know who gave you the bug.  They're tracking the agent, not you.

Refusing to talk to them perpetuates the spread of things that kill people.  Like influenza, SARS, plague (if you live in Arizona and New Mexico this is an issue), hanta, West Nile, HIV, etc...

[austin_submale]

13 minutes ago, mpjockstrap said:

No.  It never went away.  They aren't puritans trying to steer people to God, they don't care usually.  They want to know who gave you the bug.  They're tracking the agent, not you.

Refusing to talk to them perpetuates the spread of things that kill people.  Like influenza, SARS, plague (if you live in Arizona and New Mexico this is an issue), hanta, West Nile, HIV, etc...

So what is the utility of that?  Especially for something like West Nile that is mosquito spread...  How would someone know anything useful about how they got it?  What kind of questions would they ask?  Seems like an awful lot of effort for not much useful information.

So I am sure some people know or at least have a good idea who gave them the bug but a lot of others who are promiscuous probably don't really know.  Whether they are going to try to "steer people to God" or whether they just want to try to shut down bookstores, bath houses or cruising spots...  Not sure talking to them is a win...

[viking8x6]

39 minutes ago, austin_submale said:

So what is the utility of that?  ...  What kind of questions would they ask?  Seems like an awful lot of effort for not much useful information.

About 20 years ago, I had syphilis. It is one of the reportable diseases. So I had to go in to the county health department and answer a few questions about my contacts. They wanted me to tell them who they were, and I refused on privacy grounds, but I did have to promise to try to inform them. All the fuck buddies, I did. Including a guy I was dating at the time who absolutely had kittens because he was bi and his girlfriend worked with kids (therefore if she were exposed it would be a huge deal for reasons I don't understand but clearly aren't logical). All the guys at the bookstore, well, I have no clue who they were, so they didn't find out from me. Although they are the likelier source.

It is an awful lot of effort, and often the information isn't very useful. But it does allow public health workers to get an idea of what is going around where, and at least try to keep people informed. This is how we find out about an outbreak of monkeypox and control it before it gets out of hand. This is why, once, when I was cruising in Buena Vista Park in San Francisco, I saw a prominently placed sign on neon lime colored stock notifying people that there had been a high number of syphilis cases in people who frequented the park, and to take precautions. And yeah, I did want to know. Syphilis is a bitch.

[ellentonboy]

13 hours ago, austin_submale said:

I've heard back in the day that the health departments would actually try to contact people who got certain diseases...  HIV, syph, etc...  But I thought that went away years ago.

 

I don't know when you live but I can say in Pinellas and Manatee county, Florida, if your name is given as a sexual contact for someone testing positive for syphilis, you will get a phone call from the health department.  I know in Hillsborough county they will put notes under your door and call the house and threaten to come and pick you up if you don't get treatment.  I have found that, at least it's been my experience, that the majority of these calls are "false alarms".  Since I see a private infectious disease specialist I contact him, make an appointment and his office staff deals with the health department.    It's only been once or twice but they are very persistent in this area, and generally nice about it once you tell them you have a private doctor and he'll handle the treatment.  

[austin_submale]

2 minutes ago, ellentonboy said:

I don't know when you live but I can say in Pinellas and Manatee county, Florida, if your name is given as a sexual contact for someone testing positive for syphilis, you will get a phone call from the health department.  I know in Hillsborough county they will put notes under your door and call the house and threaten to come and pick you up if you don't get treatment.  I have found that, at least it's been my experience, that the majority of these calls are "false alarms".  Since I see a private infectious disease specialist I contact him, make an appointment and his office staff deals with the health department.    It's only been once or twice but they are very persistent in this area, and generally nice about it once you tell them you have a private doctor and he'll handle the treatment.  

I almost never know or have contact information for any of the guys that fuck me.  In fact, basically only one right now.  There are a few others that I see occasionally from apps but that's the only way I know how to contact them.  All the others are random anonymous at the bookstores.  Some that I recognize but many I've never met before.  And it is usually dark so hard to see.  And I never give my real name...  So I am not sure how they'd ever find me.

 

[ellentonboy]

1 hour ago, austin_submale said:

I almost never know or have contact information for any of the guys that fuck me.  In fact, basically only one right now.  There are a few others that I see occasionally from apps but that's the only way I know how to contact them.  All the others are random anonymous at the bookstores.  Some that I recognize but many I've never met before.  And it is usually dark so hard to see.  And I never give my real name...  So I am not sure how they'd ever find me.

 

For me, it has been a situation where my name and even home phone number was given to the health department, and based on timing, I had an idea as to who it was that said they passed it along to me.

But I understand what you are saying, I wouldn't know people's names and phone numbers from a large majority of the guys I hooked up with.  I may know their first name, their screen name and what app or site I met them on.  Funny, the few times I was called by the health department they never asked me questions about contact.  All they wanted my doctor to contact them and let them know he was treating me so that I wouldn't spread any further.  For me, I never felt interrogated, the person contacting me almost seemed relieved I was willing to cooperate and that was the end of our interaction.  My doctor's office did the rest.