Gender-affirming Care for Trans Youth

[gimpsub69]

Just now, gimpsub69 said:

This is not true. While in the minority by a lot comparably to most gender affirming surgeries, there's been girls ages 12-14 who had top surgeries. Another point is the countries that were leading countries for gender affirming Care on minors have all reversed course. Maybe we should ask them why they did that. Once age of consent do whatever you want 

Puberty blockers aren't reversible see Sweden Finland Australia New Zealand and the UK who are all 3 years ahead of the US 

[viking8x6]

@gimpsub69, if you are going to contradict me, it would be helpful to everyone if you referenced some actual information. I don't claim to be an expert in this area, but I am an expert in science. Opinions without data remain just that. I, for one, am actually interested in learning something about the issue (as well as debunking misinformation) - otherwise I would not have started the topic.

This is a subject where nuance is kind of important. Making black and white blanket statements is counterproductive. And yes, I do realize that I did so in a fairly unqualified way in my post above. Mea culpa.

 

2 hours ago, gimpsub69 said:

This is not true // "... in the minority by a lot comparably to most gender affirming surgeries, there's been girls ages 12-14 who had top surgeries"

As I was speaking in generalities, what I said is in fact true for most cases. You just said so.

2 hours ago, gimpsub69 said:

Puberty blockers aren't reversible // see Sweden Finland Australia New Zealand and the UK who are all 3 years ahead of the US 

I did a little digging (absent any links from you) and it does not appear to me that your assertion about puberty blockers is correct. It is true that people in these countries are taking a different approach to qualifying children for these therapies, but that is based (as far as I can tell) on a risk/benefit analysis rather than on any data that the blockers aren't reversible.

Here's a specific document from Sweden outlining what they are doing:

https://segm.org/segm-summary-sweden-prioritizes-therapy-curbs-hormones-for-gender-dysphoric-youth

Of note is that they are recommending that psychotherapy be the first line treatment, and that "dysphoria, rather than identity" be the basis for drug or hormone intervention.

Also of note is that the approach they are now taking will be consistent with the "Dutch Protocol", which in fact is what I described above. I conclude that they were applying these treatments more liberally prior to the current changes.

[PozBearWI]

Thanks @viking8x6  That page opens with this:

Following a comprehensive review of evidence, the NBHW concluded that the evidence base for hormonal interventions for gender-dysphoric youth is of low quality, and that hormonal treatments may carry risks. NBHW also concluded that the evidence for pediatric transition comes from studies where the population was markedly different from the cases presenting for care today. In addition, NBHW noted increasing reports of detransition and transition-related regret among youth who transitioned in recent years.

NBHW emphasized the need to treat gender dysphoric youth with dignity and respect, while providing high quality, evidence-based medical care that prioritizes long-term health. NBHW also emphasized that identity formation in youth is an evolving process, and that the experience of natural puberty is a vital step in the development of the overall identity, as well as gender identity.

In light of above limitations in the evidence base, the ongoing identity formation in youth, and in view of the fact that gender transition has pervasive and lifelong consequences, the NBHW has concluded that, at present, the risks of hormonal interventions for gender dysphoric youth outweigh the potential benefits.

As a result of this determination, the eligibility for pediatric gender transition with puberty blockers and cross-sex hormones in Sweden will be sharply curtailed. Only a minority of gender dysphoric youth—those with the “classic” childhood onset of cross-sex identification and distress, which persist and cause clear suffering in adolescence—will be considered as potentially eligible for hormonal interventions, pending additional, extensive multidisciplinary evaluation.

For all others, including the now-prevalent cohort of youth whose transgender identities emerged for the first time during or after puberty, psychiatric care and gender-exploratory psychotherapy will be offered instead. Exceptions will be made on a case-by-case basis, and the number of clinics providing pediatric gender transition will be reduced to a few highly specialized centralized care centers.

 

 

[JessicaDiamond]

On 7/6/2023 at 9:57 AM, gimpsub69 said:

Puberty blockers aren't reversible see Sweden Finland Australia New Zealand and the UK who are all 3 years ahead of the US 

Puberty blockers ARE reversible and completely safe. They've been used to treat early onset puberty since the mid 1980s. The first use for trans kids wasn't until a decade later.

 

If you haven't noticed fascism and bigotry have been on the rise internationally for the last seven years. That explains your assertion about other countries "stepping back" from trans health care. Just in case you're either too unkowlegable or too blinded by ideology, let me put it in writing for you. As right wing politicians gain power in government, they make it harder for trans people in general and trans children in specific to access health care and live their lives in an effort to reduce/remove them from the population (AKA soft genocide).

On 7/6/2023 at 9:56 AM, gimpsub69 said:

Once age of consent do whatever you want 

I hope you hold the same views for ALL medical procedures. (tonsillectomy, wisdom teeth removal, cavity removal, broken bones, eye examination, vaccinations, cancer treatments, early onset puberty, diabetic treatments, to name a few) Otherwise you'd just be a hateful hypocrite. Oh, BTW, if a minor is "too young" or "too immature" to know what their gender identity is, then they're too young and immature to know what their sexual orientation is. Just sayin

[Zoey]

Ironically that people whine about "kids getting surgery" yet being against puberty blockers.

With kids being educated on gender and LGBTQ identities they notice sooner who they are which allows them to get puberty blockers which in turn makes it so they won't need alot of surgeries as they will never develop in the wrong body.

So I see it as a very good thing that kids won't need to go through having their voice turn into a big issue that might need vocal chord surgery or lots of painful training, or growing boobs that they later have to get a mastectomy to remove.

Then again cis kids has been using gormone blockers for decades without anyone reacting. So all pushback is only because  hateful groups riling up the public to a imaginary issue because they have no real platform beyond spreading hate

Edited July 25, 2023 by Zoey

[ftmbristolukfun]

In the UK gender affirming healthcare for trans youth is under threat. The people who are supposed to be supporting young people to become who they are, instead fail the children. It's a sad state of affairs and I fear for the future of trans children.

 

Suicide, self harm, mental breakdown, wreckless behaviour is going to increase if something isn't done to protect and nuture our trans youth.

[Guest]

On 8/7/2023 at 10:39 PM, ftmbristolukfun said:

In the UK gender affirming healthcare for trans youth is under threat. The people who are supposed to be supporting young people to become who they are, instead fail the children. It's a sad state of affairs and I fear for the future of trans children.

 

Suicide, self harm, mental breakdown, wreckless behaviour is going to increase if something isn't done to protect and nuture our trans youth.

Youngsters have no ego worth mentioning. Their poor notion of self means they can be manipulated easily, making them do things they didn't want, purely because someone older said it was good. Groomers exploit this fact to convince very young children to "perform". Convincing children they are in the wrong body, solely based on how a boy plays with his dick, results in a child being miserable because he's now convinced there's something wrong with his body when, in fact, it's exactly as it's meant to be. Just because a girl prefers to kick a ball to playing "mum" doesn't mean she's in the wrong body and needs her chest mutilated.

All this "get 'em while they're young" comes across as perverts grooming children into a lifestyle that's completely unnatural for them; a lifestyle they lack the ego to state confidently is their true identity. Read the story of that Jaz Jennings and his truly obnoxious mother for a real-world example of how to destroy a boy's life. There's a reason for voting age, driving age, sexual intercourse age and other similar constraints. People have known forever that we need to reach a certain level of maturity in order to make solid decisions. Giving children the power to act on impulse, resulting in permanent, life-altering, actions is wrong. I think this is one things about which the UK is right.

Our lifestyles are NOT for children. Anyone who claims otherwise is confirming what certain sections of society think of us. Want you truly to arm your enemies?

[BootmanLA]

15 hours ago, Yorksub said:

Youngsters have no ego worth mentioning. Their poor notion of self means they can be manipulated easily, making them do things they didn't want, purely because someone older said it was good. Groomers exploit this fact to convince very young children to "perform". Convincing children they are in the wrong body, solely based on how a boy plays with his dick, results in a child being miserable because he's now convinced there's something wrong with his body when, in fact, it's exactly as it's meant to be. Just because a girl prefers to kick a ball to playing "mum" doesn't mean she's in the wrong body and needs her chest mutilated.

All this "get 'em while they're young" comes across as perverts grooming children into a lifestyle that's completely unnatural for them; a lifestyle they lack the ego to state confidently is their true identity. Read the story of that Jaz Jennings and his truly obnoxious mother for a real-world example of how to destroy a boy's life. There's a reason for voting age, driving age, sexual intercourse age and other similar constraints. People have known forever that we need to reach a certain level of maturity in order to make solid decisions. Giving children the power to act on impulse, resulting in permanent, life-altering, actions is wrong. I think this is one things about which the UK is right.

Our lifestyles are NOT for children. Anyone who claims otherwise is confirming what certain sections of society think of us. Want you truly to arm your enemies?

I'm starting to wonder now, which right-wing troll that got dumped off this site before is now back with a new handle and profile?

[Guest]

On 11/10/2023 at 2:55 AM, BootmanLA said:

I'm starting to wonder now, which right-wing troll that got dumped off this site before is now back with a new handle and profile?

No idea who you mean. I'm just a man with an opinion.

[BootmanLA]

6 hours ago, Yorksub said:

No idea who you mean. I'm just a man with an opinion.

If you say so. Your rhetoric is very familiar-sounding and I know a few people who've expressed similar "opinions" who've gotten banned for other infractions. 

[hntnhole]

I don't know how I missed this topic entirely, but I did.  Fascinating issue and discussion. 

Thanks.