Regarding the events of last night.

[hntnhole]

Political disagreements on all kinds of subjects are inevitable, and perfectly acceptable when discussed in a civil manner.  

Murder of political opponents, or attempted murder (of anyone, for that matter), or beating or corporal attacks are never ever acceptable, save for defense of the nation during declared war against aggressor nations.    

While Mr. Trump is mistaken, benighted in many areas of discourse, he is deserving of the most foundational level of respect; that of being allowed to live his life.  Each human being on the face of the earth deserves that most basic right to exist.  

It's hardly any secret to the readership of BZ that I heartily disagree with Mr. Trump on many issues, but that in no way excuses the outrage perpetrated last night against not only Mr. Trump, but against our Government, our electoral process, and the basic human decency with which we humans must treat each other.  Everyone is guaranteed the right to voice their views, in either a genteel fashion or more bluntly.  The shooter was, apparently, socially disturbed, which is no excuse whatsoever.  It may be the reason behind the events of last night, but murder (or corporal violence) is absolutely not acceptable, no matter what the cause or issue.  

While I stand against virtually every aspect of Mr. Trump's platform/proposals, and I stand for his right to announce, argue-for them.  Killing, or attempts to kill the messenger however, goes against every most basic human instinct, (let alone our tradition of allowing everyone their say), every sense of decency, and must never be tolerated, excused, or sloughed off.  

Whatever happens politically in November, this event will not help the discourse one way or the other.  It's nothing less than tragic, and we must learn from it, and reconfirm our beliefs that this misguided attempt to silence a political figure is unsound.  What counts is civil discourse on the issues of the day, and nothing less.  

[NWUSHorny]

I fully agree with you. What is bothering me the most this morning are the MAGA's claiming "the 1st shot has been fired," or "the storm is here." While I can't do anything about the fact that they feel that way, another subset of the MAGA is capitalizing on it to persuade others that for this reason, those that oppose his policy and behavior can no longer call him out on those policies and behaviors. It is being used as yet another opportunity to shut down debate, which will only further escalate the violence.

 

[onlyraw]

I also fully agree 

we can only attempt to strive for “liberty and justice for all” if we very clearly live with the ballot over the bullet

if we are going to denounce the actions of Jan. 6 - than we need to just as strongly denounce the actions of the shooter 

I to disagree with I think just about every aspect of what Mr Trump and his maga gang stands for 

But if we want to stop the maga gang it needs to be resoundingly at the ballot box in Nov

[Loveitraw]

Watching these events unfold from outside it is interesting, and scary, to note how quickly the various outlets go into overdrive to shape the narrative.

Certainly we have already seen the Republican machine selling the line of, "strong, warrior, hero." And its pretty obvious that this will continue all the way to the polls.

The actions of the shooter have rightly been denounced from all sides, but with each finding an excuse to blame their opposition for provoking the act.

We will undoubtedly see in the coming weeks the speculation and investigation that tells us the motives of the shooter. Then we will see the conspiracies, and already have seen the start of these from every angle.

I guess my point is that keeping an open mind and always questioning things is important, that and getting information from multiple sources.

Lastly, yes this was a terrible act but it doesn't negate or forgive the terrible things Trump has done.

Like I said outsider here, I don't have a dog in this race, but I wish you all well from across the pond.

 

[PozBearWI]

Right now we're in the media storm.  Lot's to settle out and the big summer R show starting tomorrow here in Wisconsin.  Let's give it a week and then see how things appear....

[BootmanLA]

So here's the picture, as it's coming into clearer focus.

A REPUBLICAN, exploiting REPUBLICAN-supported gun laws and court decisions, fired a gun beloved by REPUBLICANS, at another REPUBLICAN, who traffics in violent rhetoric, incitement and threats, at a REPUBLICAN rally - 

and somehow it's the Democrats' fault.

[Loveitraw]

2 hours ago, BootmanLA said:

So here's the picture, as it's coming into clearer focus.

A REPUBLICAN, exploiting REPUBLICAN-supported gun laws and court decisions, fired a gun beloved by REPUBLICANS, at another REPUBLICAN, who traffics in violent rhetoric, incitement and threats, at a REPUBLICAN rally - 

and somehow it's the Democrats' fault.

This was what I was alluding to in my earlier post, and is a reminder to not try to frame concise arguments when tired which probably explains the confused response I got.

The amount of spin that will be put on this event will be insane.

Both sides will frame it and the followers of each will eat it up. Somewhere underneath it all the truth will be shrouded by a picture of a terrible person, who just narrowly avoided being murdered, punching the air in defiance.

[hntnhole]

11 hours ago, BootmanLA said:

and somehow it's the Democrats' fault.

Brief, and boiled down to it's lowest common denominator.  Well said. 

Thanks.

[Rillion]

Looking more and more like the shooter shared many traits with previous mass shooters and decided to suicide by cop/secret service while trying to go out famous.

 

John Wilkes Booth 

Lee Harvard Oswald

Sirhan Sirhan

John Hinkley Jr.

 

This young man's political affiliations do not appear to be connected to his motivation, yet people will try to spin it as being politically motivated in order to advance their own political agenda.

[BlueSaphir]

When the election comes, I just hope majority Americans really see of Trump and many his supporters of allies. They want more control of money, power. Make very extreme far right lose control of power. 
 

This man is a con, treason. Absolutely not a hero. 

[hntnhole]

I'm waiting to see how the Magaroids try to turn the Menendez issue into political theater.  

There's simply no way that any collection/group of folks never ever has a mickey slip through.  He started out great many years ago, so I hear, but caved to his greed for more dough (and Egyptian bling). 

That character flaw can infect anyone, of any persuasion I suppose.  

[PozBearWI]

14 hours ago, Rillion said:

Looking more and more like the shooter shared many traits with previous mass shooters and decided to suicide by cop/secret service while trying to go out famous.

 

John Wilkes Booth 

Lee Harvard Oswald

Sirhan Sirhan

John Hinkley Jr.

 

This young man's political affiliations do not appear to be connected to his motivation, yet people will try to spin it as being politically motivated in order to advance their own political agenda.

Unfortunately we don't know if it is connected to his politics.  We won't likely find out for months or more; long after our squirrel or clownfish news cycle has moved on to the next big thing.  

[BootmanLA]

On 7/16/2024 at 1:31 AM, Rillion said:

Looking more and more like the shooter shared many traits with previous mass shooters and decided to suicide by cop/secret service while trying to go out famous.

John Wilkes Booth 

Lee Harvard Oswald

Sirhan Sirhan

John Hinkley Jr.

This young man's political affiliations do not appear to be connected to his motivation, yet people will try to spin it as being politically motivated in order to advance their own political agenda.

I'll agree that there may well be some/many traits shared between Trump's shooter and the list you provided.

That said: none of these were aiming for "suicide by cop". Booth shot Lincoln and fled; he wasn't caught until 12 days later. Oswald was captured alive and was subsequently killed by Jack Ruby two days later. Sirhan Sirhan and John Hinkley Jr. are still alive.