"Trump administration purges websites across federal health agencies"

[PozBearWI]

Interesting @viking8x6, I didn't realize they had been in use for multiple decades.  

And indeed I honestly had no idea of the duration of use.  Delaying puberty 3 to 5 years is certainly a rational approach.  Although I am curious if the long term effects of such a delay has been studied much?  

My life position on choices about our own bodies is one of my longest held beliefs.  We've always had parts of society telling everyone else what they should do.  And many of our fellow citizens are firmly in the "do as I say, not what I do" camp.  

[viking8x6]

5 minutes ago, PozBearWI said:

Interesting @viking8x6, I didn't realize they had been in use for multiple decades.

And indeed I honestly had no idea of the duration of use.  Delaying puberty 3 to 5 years is certainly a rational approach.  Although I am curious if the long term effects of such a delay has been studied much?  

My life position on choices about our own bodies is one of my longest held beliefs.  We've always had parts of society telling everyone else what they should do.  And many of our fellow citizens are firmly in the "do as I say, not what I do" camp.  

I didn't realize it either, but your post got me curious so I looked it up. They were approved for use (for precocious puberty) in the mid-90s and were very quickly adopted for use in gender supportive therapy. 

The long term effects of the treatment haven't been studied much (as the article I read mentioned, manufacturers don't want to spend money on it because it's "a political hot potato"). Inasmuch as they have been (with the earliest patients now in their 40s), they do not appear to have frequent long-term negative effects [my paraphrase].

Personal sovereignty is a core value of mine for certain, and has been for as long as I can remember. I believe we need a constitutional amendment or three on the topic...

[NastyRigPig]

I can’t believe there are still gay people who support him.  They’ll be on the same train to the camps that I will be. 

[Erik62]

3 hours ago, BootmanLA said:

With respect, what happened at Tavistock in the UK has zero bearing on whether those surgeries are occurring in the United States, which (given that this topic is about Trump and health care) is the parameter at hand. Just because, say, certain African countries permit female genital mutilation doesn't mean that FGM is even occurring in the US, much less on a widespread basis. (I'm well aware it may be happening under the radar in some immigrant communities, but that's a far cry from the outrage over "they're letting this thing happen all over!" that we're seeing about trans surgery for minors.

I'll also note that even if I agreed with your categorical statement about "no irreversible change", puberty blockers - which accounts for about 99% of the pre-age-of-majority "intervention" in this country - is not in fact "irreversible". Simply stopping taking them allows puberty to progress.

SORRY BootmanLA if you have taken my discussion as a specifically US issue & that full transition was being practiced. I believe my intention was to participate on a broader international basis of action / reaction to a world-wide issue / problem. Although, there is in fact legislation in most countries, that does actually allow surgical transitioning in minors, for medical reasons. Also, just wondering where in my comments did I actually raise the issues of FGM & other cultural practices of genital mutilation. 

    Trump & Health Care is the main topic of discussion & so I ran with the "outrage" of under age transitioning & the specific / undetermined side effects that this would / could leave. I used the Tavistock Clinic (London) as an example of the bizarre lengths that must be guarded against. 

  "..... no irreversible change to mental or physical developement.....". Once again you have misread my comments. At no time did I state that Puberty Blockers provided irreversible changes. I reiterate that my discussion was from an international viewpoint. You cannot disagree that full transitioning of children, has been discussed by the more radical trans groups. I do know that the idea has been "thrown around" by certain elements (there is always a fringe that want to push the limits) in Australia, the UK, Sweden, Denmark & most other Western countries (US included, I would imagine) on that basis my comments of irreversible changes were made. 

  When commenting I attempt to express myself as clearly as possible. Unfortunately, in attempting to do so my screeds can get rather lengthy & as I have found my intent is still misinterpreted, for this I apologise AGAIN. 

[hntnhole]

20 hours ago, viking8x6 said:

Personal sovereignty is a core value of mine for certain, and has been for as long as I can remember. I believe we need a constitutional amendment or three on the topic...

Amen to that !!!  

Three for starters, anyway ... 

[PozBearWI]

20 hours ago, Erik62 said:

SORRY BootmanLA if you have taken my discussion as a specifically US issue & that full transition was being practiced. I believe my intention was to participate on a broader international basis of action / reaction to a world-wide issue / problem. Although, there is in fact legislation in most countries, that does actually allow surgical transitioning in minors, for medical reasons. Also, just wondering where in my comments did I actually raise the issues of FGM & other cultural practices of genital mutilation. 

    Trump & Health Care is the main topic of discussion & so I ran with the "outrage" of under age transitioning & the specific / undetermined side effects that this would / could leave. I used the Tavistock Clinic (London) as an example of the bizarre lengths that must be guarded against. 

  "..... no irreversible change to mental or physical developement.....". Once again you have misread my comments. At no time did I state that Puberty Blockers provided irreversible changes. I reiterate that my discussion was from an international viewpoint. You cannot disagree that full transitioning of children, has been discussed by the more radical trans groups. I do know that the idea has been "thrown around" by certain elements (there is always a fringe that want to push the limits) in Australia, the UK, Sweden, Denmark & most other Western countries (US included, I would imagine) on that basis my comments of irreversible changes were made. 

  When commenting I attempt to express myself as clearly as possible. Unfortunately, in attempting to do so my screeds can get rather lengthy & as I have found my intent is still misinterpreted, for this I apologise AGAIN. 

 

@Erik62 there is a huge amount of value in discussing and observing across our species rather than limit to a geographic area.  Although I'll ask your forbearance.  Here in the US it is as if we live next to an out of control teenager playing what he calls "music" at full volume 24x7.  Whose goal seems to be that we stop talking with each other.  

What Trump is doing isn't "healthcare".  It is celebrating the unfettered spread of disease across humanity.  Big beautiful measles???  WTF?  

When I communicate with you and others in Australia, man please help your fellow citizens see the Orange Clown for what he is and not make the same mistakes my fellow US citizens made.  

[Erik62]

3 hours ago, PozBearWI said:

 

@Erik62 there is a huge amount of value in discussing and observing across our species rather than limit to a geographic area.  Although I'll ask your forbearance.  Here in the US it is as if we live next to an out of control teenager playing what he calls "music" at full volume 24x7.  Whose goal seems to be that we stop talking with each other.  

What Trump is doing isn't "healthcare".  It is celebrating the unfettered spread of disease across humanity.  Big beautiful measles???  WTF?  

When I communicate with you and others in Australia, man please help your fellow citizens see the Orange Clown for what he is and not make the same mistakes my fellow US citizens made.  

Could not agree more & my continual posting of anti Trump comments & memes, Tumblr, Facebook & Bluesky (I got kicked off Twitter) shows my deep dislike (hatred) of this uncouth piece of garbage. 

    Unfortuneately, his extreme right ramblings also have counterpoints on the extreme left & this is why I often play Devil's Advocate. 

   I have always respected the role the US has taken over the last 80yrs & it is truly heartbreaking to see the destruction that Trump has already wrought. Hopefully, this can be countered in the mid-terms but, it will take a massive job for the US to return to the international fold. GOD willing, the sensible thinkers (both Dem & Rep) will find the strength to do this.

  WE, Australia 🇦🇺, will ALWAYS SUPPORT the US & be grateful for our shared values of loyalty, compassion & Freedom 🇦🇺🇺🇲. 

[PozBearWI]

27 minutes ago, Erik62 said:

Could not agree more & my continual posting of anti Trump comments & memes, Tumblr, Facebook & Bluesky (I got kicked off Twitter) shows my deep dislike (hatred) of this uncouth piece of garbage. 

    Unfortuneately, his extreme right ramblings also have counterpoints on the extreme left & this is why I often play Devil's Advocate. 

   I have always respected the role the US has taken over the last 80yrs & it is truly heartbreaking to see the destruction that Trump has already wrought. Hopefully, this can be countered in the mid-terms but, it will take a massive job for the US to return to the international fold. GOD willing, the sensible thinkers (both Dem & Rep) will find the strength to do this.

  WE, Australia 🇦🇺, will ALWAYS SUPPORT the US & be grateful for our shared values of loyalty, compassion & Freedom 🇦🇺🇺🇲. 

Indeed, the bull in a china shop analogy is apt.  I'll be long dead before the US rebuilds those alliances again along with trust that they will withstand the next dumb ass POTUS.  As far as 2026 elections, not hard to predict how they will fall. But it might be challenging to swear those people in...  When POTUS ignores laws and the courts let me get away with it, it creates fractures where there should be no fractures.

[Erik62]

12 minutes ago, PozBearWI said:

Indeed, the bull in a china shop analogy is apt.  I'll be long dead before the US rebuilds those alliances again along with trust that they will withstand the next dumb ass POTUS.  As far as 2026 elections, not hard to predict how they will fall. But it might be challenging to swear those people in...  When POTUS ignores laws and the courts let me get away with it, it creates fractures where there should be no fractures.

Dare I suggest the stories of JFK & the Skripals et al, have NOT BEEN FORGOTTEN??? 

[PozBearWI]

Well of course you can dare Erik.  

The Orange Clown though is unique; and we've no history in the US that actually compares.