Romantic relationship

[tallslenderguy]

i don't seem to be able to escape or quench the desire for a romantic relationship.  i've watched way to many romantic gay movies where romance is portrayed, but have never found that irl with a guy. Not for lack of trying. i've been on dating sites for years where scads of guys claim to be looking for intimate, romantic relationship. But many of those are scammers. The real ones often do not have a profile, or a cookie cutter profile that says generic stuff like "like to eat out, watch movies, walk on the beach" lol. sigh. 

i have detailed profiles that i keep up to date for guys looking to read and respond to. Easily 90% of the time, i am the one to initiate conversation, which is not easy when all a guy has in a profile is "looking for ltr."  9 times out of 10, guys do not respond... okay, it's obvious i'm not the droid they are looking for. 

Still, my overall impression is that guys don't really want romantic relationship, or they have no idea how to be a part of the effort to make one happen? 

i'm rambling, i know. Be interested to read the thoughts and feelings of others on this topic. i know, it's complicated.

[PozTalkAuthor]

Personal experience makes no statistics, but I can share mine. 

I've had 3 long term stories with guys in those 27 years, the fourth is the current one and we just celebrated our first year but... 

Despite being a fanatic computer geek and professional, I've never used (and liked) dating apps! Maybe it's a prejudice but I have always considered them as OK for sexual adventures but not for something more important - a friendship or more. 

Then, I met one of my boyfriends into a forum about books, I found my best friend searching for information on TV shows and encountered her blog, the guy who gave me HIV was introduced by my first ex who insisted on "if you fall from the horse, jump on it again". 

My last and worst ex, it was a random meeting you know one friend meets another and another more! 

My current love... He's been my co-worker and friend for 12 years! And our affair started after a very long confidence - I'm convinced he has loved me for long but always denied his real sexual desires, marrying a woman and betraying her with other girls day after day. 

To be honest, after I got HIV from the serial cheater, I fell in that phylosophy about "gay men are like this. Promiscuous. Forget monogamy and get laid with whoever, love but get sex freedom as a value". 

With that I met my abuser who I was in open relationship with, but he's used me in many ways! 

Romantic relationship with the current guy, was completely unexpected and... Unexpressed! He's continued for months saying "we're doing something wrong, I shouldn't"... 

I shouldn't, nothing! Now it's going ahead. No projects of living together at moment, we have our own spaces but we're currently monogamous as we feel it's the condition making us more comfortable with ourselves. 

Well, I'd be stupid saying "love comes when you do not even expect", it's a pre-built sentence as "gays are promiscuous, accept it and give up with love"...

Only thing I can tell you is that everyone has their way of living. If I believe in love found via apps... To be honest, no, as in the apps you can be anyone. 

If this can help you, I came here with just the writing and fun purpose. 

And found both good sexting buddies, and even some guys I confront myself in serious topic. Not calling it friendship but nothing can be excluded in life! 

I just say don't give up and don't listen to people suggesting you to. Hugs. Here for confront if needed.

 

[tallslenderguy]

1 hour ago, PozTalkAuthor said:

Personal experience makes no statistics, but I can share mine. 

 

True, but i am not particularly seeking an evidence based relationship <3.

Thank you for your considerate response here, and in this forum in general. i value your thoughtful presence on BZ.

i did have one 31 year relationship, married to a woman as a gay guy. It wasn't what either of us needed in many ways, but it was a real relationship in many ways. Processing out of that relationship brought me to a non traditional, but honest, real place.  For instance, i do not consider love/romance to necessarily be monogamous, nor am i locked into non-monogamy either. 

i don't believe in the Disneyesque ideas of 'one true love' or that nature (or who/whatever) has selected just one match. To me, that's more storybook.  Which is not to suggest that i think one cannot experience someone who ends up being their  one true love. Lol, i know, i should run for office with my ability to take either side in an argument. 

As i have come to see it, relationship starts with self knowledge. i believe to have a successful relationship, we have to know our own needs and wants. Along with that knowledge, i think we have to develop the skills of communication and invest in open disclosure with guys we want to have a potential relationship with. i think the notion that love is something one "falls into" is haphazard at best. Been there, it didn't work when it came down to filling in for lack of compatibility. i love/loved my former wife, but i'me gay, she's straight, we're both 'bottom,' she's conservative religious, i cannot commit to a supposed being i cannot reasonably substantiate. Any one of those could nix a romantic relationship. We had those and more. 

i do lean into (heavily) the idea of yin/Yang and that opposites attract and bond, thus the need for self knowledge and self disclosure.  Where i seem to run into issues is meeting guys whose eyes don't roll back in their heads when i start talking that way. 

You may be right about the use of internet being a poor choice for meeting someone. The few social venues i have tried all seem to come with paired people. i suppose i could consider becoming a home wrecker. Seriously though, i think you make a good point about trying venues other than online.  i do live in a small town, not much of a gay community, but perhaps should try harder at something different. i'm not desperate, but i'd like something more. 

Edited October 7, 2023 by tallslenderguy

[PozTalkAuthor]

The fairy tale idea of "soulmates", "our half", "mr. right" and so on, have ruined our approach to relationship in general, this is what I think! 

My first ex for instance, he's been a drug addict for years and he recovered, finding me and being my very first sexual partner made him feel in heaven, then 11th September 2001 came, Twin Towers attack and all that stuff... 

Many matters linked to points of view about this tragedy, led him to feel excluded at work and among friends, he had just me but I could do nothing as he started chems again. 

Drugs have destroyed our relationship but, know what, we are still very good friends, now he's sober again. 

The others, one died and the last I don't want even to see his photo around... And this one? What you said about trust, communication, knowing (and loving) ourselves, started much before I even suspected we could ever become a couple. He has been, and is, the person I can trust most. The first man to know I am HIV positive, for example; before my biological family. 

If I think the former drug-addict guy is my very first love? Yes, I do. If I still love him? Yes, I do, not in the couple/romance way though. 

When I was with my ex (the abuser), he never liked him and I didn't listen as I thought about him being somehow jealous. No, he was in "former drug addict mode" and attempted to warn me that the person in question was an abuser, an alcoholic, but I was caught by the, let's call it, blindness of love and "I'll save your life, I'll make you change". 

Oh gosh, you, 31 years with a female hiding your real sexuality... It could have been not so easy for you! 

I had a short flirt with a girl when I was a teen but I didn't really manage to make it last, my heart brought me elsewhere. To MUSIC, and GUYS! These were times of full AIDS emergency so music was my only love then. 

[hntnhole]

4 hours ago, tallslenderguy said:

As i have come to see it, relationship starts with self knowledge

I agree with you.  Without knowledge of ones self, we've failed to open the valve to honesty, which makes giving/receiving love a tough nut to crack.  You strike me as a guy whose thoughtful pursuit of self-knowledge would make you all the more attractive to a man needing more than just himself in his life.  Regardless of the unfortunate events in your past, that's where they are now - in your past.  You've learned from them and come out the other side a better (pardon me, but ...) Man because of it.  If there's any one issue, it's probably the severely limited pool of out/confident/no-bullshit gay men in your area.  You've got a lot going for you - except the numbers of guys to draw from.  When the time is right, you already know what to do.  

Edited October 8, 2023 by hntnhole
correction

[PozTalkAuthor]

On 10/8/2023 at 2:42 AM, hntnhole said:

I agree with you.  Without knowledge of ones self, we've failed to open the valve to honesty, which makes giving/receiving love a tough nut to crack.  You strike me as a guy whose thoughtful pursuit of self-knowledge would make you all the more attractive to a man needing more than just himself in his life.  Regardless of the unfortunate events in your past, that's where they are now - in your past.  You've learned from them and come out the other side a better (pardon me, but ...) Man because of it.  If there's any one issue, it's probably the severely limited pool of out/confident/no-bullshit gay men in your area.  You've got a lot going for you - except the numbers of guys to draw from.  When the time is right, you already know what to do.  

 

My psycho-therapist I attended when I had to deal both with long-term relationship breakup and with HIV, told me I could not think to love others, if I didn't start loving and accepting myself. HIV included. 

Damn if he was right, he was so fucking right! It only took years and years for me to embrace what "accept your HIV" really meant! 

I've managed to really feel what love means, when together with my virus I accepted my sex fantasies and stopped feeling wrong with them! So, I have started to dare a little, love means trust. And for now, I've been lucky.

[ktopper]

In my 45+ years of gay sex I have never been romantically involved with a guy. I can get kind of romantic during sex including the short time leading up to it, and if he wants to kiss and is appealing I will go along with that. It can be kind of fun. But most guys don't seem to be into that and with most of them I really don't want to play that game either. But I have never thought of a guy in a romantic way as in wanting to marry him or even live with him, I just want to fuck him. I reserve the romance for the ladies and have always ended up regretting it even with them.

I have ended up becoming friends with a few men after first hooking up for sex. Kind of nice hanging out with a guy friend who can go total faggot at a moments notice. I don't mean that derogatorily, I enjoy the sex as much as he does and it takes two to tango, and I really do think good gay sex is better with someone you have had multiple encounters with. But there is no romance involved, at least on my part.

[PigBoyDallas]

 Not interested in dating or a relationship here, just looking for no strings sex, and honestly that’s why most guys are on apps. Are there some looking for a relationship? I suppose. I’ve run into some. It’s interesting to try them out and think about maybe dating but I’m still living with my parents and not out. My life is a little complicated and messy right now. I also would struggle to be monogamous, so that’s another issue. I’m also not the romantic type and I think most guys want or expect that.

[PozTalkAuthor]

Everyone has their own character and way of living. IMHO the mistake stands on the habit to create a "model" a habit, such as "hetero are like this and gays like that".

You are not wrong because you don't feel romance, I am not wrong because I'm queer and eternal romantic! We are simply ourselves.

[MuscledHorse]

You're not going to find a date worthy guy on the hookup apps. They will be found in other places. I met my other half at an event called Furry Weekend Atlanta. Our meeting was totally by chance because we knew some of the same people in League of Atlanta pups. I was a few weeks from moving to Atlanta and he wound up being one of the guys who came up to TN to help me move, and afterwards, we started hanging out. By the time we decided to call it boyfriends about 3 months later, every guy who knew us said "it's about time you two figured it out." We've been together ever since. We both work hard and play hard. We reject sexual monogamy as a basis for a meaningful relationship and he is genuinely my best friend. We have things and interests we do and pursue separately and we have things we do and pursue together. He is not the "romantic" type (waving crucifix at Hallmark Channel) while I enjoy the cuddly-kissy stuff, which he indulges sometimes.  our ideal relationship is going to be with the guy who turns out to be our best friend and cheerleader and you, theirs. Hookup apps are not the places to meet. See what kinds of events your community has (pups, leather, gaymers, etc.) as those are the places where you're likely to meet guys you can actually socialize with, who will be more than just a hookup.

[PozTalkAuthor]

Hookup apps are for occasional adventures! That's all! 

And what I always say is to be very careful with people seeming "too romantic" "too perfect" just the right person at the right moment... My ex's mother was the target of a "romantic scam" there! I honestly feel quite scared especially for folks dreaming the person of their life. 

Maybe mine is a bias too, due to professional circumstances exposing me to the worst of the worst about on line relationships. But we can't create illusions on ourselves! 

 

You say your partner is not into kisses and cuddles soo much, oh, damn, I'm just wondering how someone can dislike this in a long-term relationship whatever you call it! 

Maybe it's me, for me body contact is essential when you're intimate. Then, as I said before, a real "model of relationship" doesn't really exist, "designing" romance in a way rather than another, is a social construct to allow people to control each other in sex and feelings. 

Coming out: I've been 6 years with a girl - sexless, just cuddles and kisses and I've never known if she was faithful or not. I think not... The first person I came out as gay with, she's still rarely in touch with me. 

But looking back I remember friends talking about frustration they assumed I felt, they said "take care of her or she'll cheat on you"... I actually cared for her but not how they meant. With first guy, then, it's been much much different! 

[Close2MyBro]

Gay romance just seems muddled with complications, and I think the curiosity and desire to experience many different men doesn't help the situation at all. I have a close group of friends who have tried the romance/dating thing all to find that one of the parties slips up. Sometimes it's a boozy night of poor choices. Sometimes its finally having that opportunity to get with someone you've been craving for a while. It also seems that the second you're in a relationship, everyone who wasn't interested in you suddenly becomes interested in you.

Then there's trying to find the "right" person. A lot of gay men are superficial and shallow, and only looking for big dicks, big bank accounts, someone to take care of them or buy them things. Or they're life is a mess in other ways like drugs, alcohol, a mountain of debt, legal issues, etc. mental health issues like self acceptance, etc. Honestly, who wants to take on al that baggage? Not me, I'd rather be single and happy than in a relationship and miserable.

[tallslenderguy]

22 hours ago, Close2MyBro said:

 

Then there's trying to find the "right" person. A lot of gay men are superficial and shallow, and only looking for big dicks, big bank accounts, someone to take care of them or buy them things. Or they're life is a mess in other ways like drugs, alcohol, a mountain of debt, legal issues, etc. mental health issues like self acceptance, etc. Honestly, who wants to take on al that baggage? Not me, I'd rather be single and happy than in a relationship and miserable.

A lot of this resonates with my experience.  i do think there are gay guys who want relationship (maybe all those gay romantic movies are written by women?. i get the impression they either have no clue about how to go about making that happen or they want someone to make it happen for them (which seems  both those may be related to one another?).  

The truth is, i don't want something traditional or heteronormative.  my idea of 'romance' (for lack of a better term) would not be restrictive for me or my partner (e.g., it might mean, but would not have to mean things like monogamy).  It might not even involve living in the same house?  

i don't know that it's because "a lot of gay men are superficial  and shallow...?"  i don't know if those things apply to gay men any more than people in general? 

i may just need more gay friends. 

[Badguy56]

I have been in a relationship most of my gay life.  My first when I was quite young with an older guy. Sex was terrible but we had lots in common. Second was love at first sight, passionate sex and common interested but as an artist life was too disordered. Third was with a much younger guy who is hot but also smart. However we both were very insecure. I am still friends with the first three. My latest 8 year marriage was a mistake.  Not much in common, and he ended up cheating on me until he left me. Sex was unpleasant as it was all self centred around him fucking me and cumming and not being aware of my pleasure. At the time I didn’t think I could do better and I just threw myself into my hobbies and work blissfully unaware and asexual. Since he left I have way more sex and better often than I did for the previous 8 years. However, I am not nearly as eager to rush into anything. Even though I have developed some attachment to a few guys I play with but now realize it is of the moment and elevated through additional stimulants.   I am resigned most likely to being single from now on. I like piggy sex with enhancements but at the same time I still have a good job, friends and many other interests. Not sure if I can find that perfect blend. If it is at all possible. I am settling for a close friend I can count on and he can count on in return. It lasts much longer, has its own romance in a way, but is not mired in jealousy and other financial, ego , substance or emotional issues. He is the person I talk to after having a particularly good or bad sexual experience, is the person who makes me laugh the most and is often the last person I wish good night to before going to sleep. Perhaps I have found it after all … 

[viking8x6]

I absolutely believe romantic relationships are  a great thing, and am fortunate to have had quite a few over the years. They don't always last, though sometimes they do, and they can certainly go wrong in a variety of ways. My experience is that expecting them to be forever is a recipe for disappointment (everything is temporary, after all), but enjoying them for what they are can be a great joy... more of one than sex, for me.

My personal experience is that they are not at all necessarily linked to a sexual connection with the person. I've had powerful sex experiences with people with whom I'd never dream of having a romantic relationship, and really good romantic relationships with people where the sexual component was not all that, or was great for a while and then faded out to little or nothing. One more reason monogamy would never work for me.