Did you get pozzed topping a bottom

[wood]

6 hours ago, concerned1 said:

The CDC puts the risk at 1 in 161 (I don't know, but I'd assume they mean uncut tops) for a single topping exposure. 

And I'd say the 1 in 161 is a deliberately very conservative estimate. So in reality it's probably a lot more risky than that. 

If you are someone like me, who is uncut and has exclusively topped countless anon bottoms in bathhouses without using condoms - then you should be very afraid. I know I am. I don't feel emotionally or mentally ready to face a poz result right now ....and I can just imagine the virus in my bloodstream now, eating up my immune system.

I've asked the question several times on the Breeding zone forums and, the general consensus is.... that even despite being uncut and exclusively top, and having fucked so, so many guys over a period of about 5 years....I'm still probaby neg.

But I refuse to believe that. I just feel that I have the virus. It's just an instinctive, gut feeling that I have. For a short while during the times I was barebacking anon ass in the saunas (what we call bathhouses here in the UK) I had an acne spot on my foreskin that I imagine the virus would have been able to get through during sex with a poz guy. I managed to bear the pain with gritted teeth and popped the acne spot on my foreskin a couple years back, but alas it was probably too late. And even if I wasn't infected that way, I probably became infected since....

You don't bareback the number of guys I've barebacked and remain neg. Unless you are an exception and unique case - there seem to be a small handful on here.

I've fucked that many guys raw I have no doubt that I am a poz top.

 

Ummm just go get tested and know? It’s not hard, and either way you get piece of mind because you know what to do then.  It obviously bothers you, and ignoring it only makes things worse.

 

As for for the question, yes it does happen. A friend of mine converted in jan and he’s a circumcised complete top that only fucks raw. Best guess for him was that he fucked a guy who was newly infected and very infectious, thus it was easier for him even as a top to contract it.

 Any HIV infection stat can be quite misleading because not all chances are created equal. For example, you can’t grt hiv from someone who doesn’t have it.  With that said, if someone is neg, and has hiv+ hvl cum in their ass, and you also fuck them, there is a theoretical exposure there. An undetectable person is also very low risk but not no risk. People that are newly infected are at much higher risk of spreading it, through topping or bottoming, etc, etc.  Because of these factors HIV exposure is NOTHING like a game of Russian roulette with a pistol that has 161 equal chances.  With hiv exposure yours could be the first one, or it may never come up.  Additionally small steps can actually reduce risk. Using plenty of good lube and washing up and urinating after sex have been shown to significantly reduce risk as a top.

[concerned1]

8 hours ago, wood said:

Ummm just go get tested and know? It’s not hard, and either way you get piece of mind because you know what to do then.  It obviously bothers you, and ignoring it only makes things worse.

  

As for for the question, yes it does happen. A friend of mine converted in jan and he’s a circumcised complete top that only fucks raw. Best guess for him was that he fucked a guy who was newly infected and very infectious, thus it was easier for him even as a top to contract it.

 Any HIV infection stat can be quite misleading because not all chances are created equal. For example, you can’t grt hiv from someone who doesn’t have it.  With that said, if someone is neg, and has hiv+ hvl cum in their ass, and you also fuck them, there is a theoretical exposure there. An undetectable person is also very low risk but not no risk. People that are newly infected are at much higher risk of spreading it, through topping or bottoming, etc, etc.  Because of these factors HIV exposure is NOTHING like a game of Russian roulette with a pistol that has 161 equal chances.  With hiv exposure yours could be the first one, or it may never come up.  Additionally small steps can actually reduce risk. Using plenty of good lube and washing up and urinating after sex have been shown to significantly reduce risk as a top.

I know. I think the 1 in 161 stat from the CDC is total bullshit. It's a conservative estimate ...as I've said, the risk in reality is most likely much, much higher than that. I've had countless discussions with people who bareback anon ass in the saunas, the cruising places, public toilets etc and msot of them are not scared because they believe topping is low risk.

When I was growing up, they always told us that anal sex is high risk for HIV infection. They did not say that ONLY bottoming is high risk. No differentiation was made between bottoming and topping. They just generalized that ANAL SEX altogether is high risk. If topping was low risk, it would not be so rampant in Africa among straight men and the virus would not be infecting people like your cut friend who you mention was/is an exclusive top.

Btw, to your question about why don't I just go get tested, since it's so easy? As I said, I don't feel I am emotionally or mentally ready to be told that I have this devastating virus. I know that, if I am infected, as I most likely am....then my immune system is being depleted as we speak....and I run the risk of falling ill with some rare opportunistic infection like Kaposi's sarcoma ....a skin cancer which will spread like wildfire over my whole body and destroy my looks....or develop pneumocystis pneumonia (a really severe form of bronchial pneuomina almost always fatal in HIV positive patients)....every day I think about it. I think about all those bare asses that I fucked in the bathhouses/saunas, in the cruising parks, the random hookups from the internet and apps like Grindr and Hornet ....all those asses that i enjoyed soooooooo fucking much. Will it all have been worth it when I'm lying in that hospital bed surrounded by my own puke and shit, having lost so much weight that I look like a someone from a Nazi concentration camp ??

Even though I know I have the virus most likely deep within my bloodstream, hoovering up all my T-cells and eating away at my brain ....the urge...no...the NEED....to go and fuck more raw ass is overwhelming. I know that fucking anon bare ass is killing me. But I cannot stop. It is an addiction like no other. Raw hole just feels so good. And yet it is probably going to be the death of me. At least I'll have died from something that I loved.

Edited May 1, 2018 by concerned1

[wood]

11 minutes ago, concerned1 said:

I know. I think the 1 in 161 stat from the CDC is total bullshit. It's a conservative estimate ...as I've said, the risk in reality is most likely much, much higher than that. I've had countless discussions with people who bareback anon ass in the saunas, the cruising places, public toilets etc and msot of them are not scared because they believe topping is low risk.

When I was growing up, they always told us that anal sex is high risk for HIV infection. They did not say that ONLY bottoming is high risk. No differentiation was made between bottoming and topping. They just generalized that ANAL SEX altogether is high risk. If topping was low risk, it would not be so rampant in Africa among straight men and the virus would not be infecting people like your cut friend who you mention was/is an exclusive top.

Btw, to your question about why don't I just go get tested, since it's so easy? As I said, I don't feel I am emotionally or mentally ready to be told that I have this devastating virus. I know that, if I am infected, as I most likely am....then my immune system is being depleted as we speak....and I run the risk of falling ill with some rare opportunistic infection like Kaposi's sarcoma ....a skin cancer which will spread like wildfire over my whole body and destroy my looks....or develop pneumocystis pneumonia (a really severe form of bronchial pneuomina almost always fatal in HIV positive patients)....every day I think about it. I think about all those bare asses that I fucked in the bathhouses/saunas, in the cruising parks, the random hookups from the internet and apps like Grindr and Hornet ....all those asses that i enjoyed soooooooo fucking much. Will it all have been worth it when I'm lying in that hospital bed surrounded by my own puke and shit, having lost so much weight that I look like a someone from a Nazi concentration camp ??

Even though I know I have the virus most likely deep within my bloodstream, hoovering up all my T-cells and eating away at my brain ....the urge...no...the NEED....to go and fuck more raw ass is overwhelming. I know that fucking anon bare ass is killing me. But I cannot stop. It is an addiction like no other. Raw hole just feels so good. And yet it is probably going to be the death of me. At least I'll have died from something that I loved.

So I guess my main question is where in the world are you located? Because depending on that, there are tons of options for you, that would mean no matter what the outcome you live a very full normal life.  By the language you use, and dialect I'm guessing in the UK, even if you quote the CDC.      

FYI, I Know EXACTLY how you feel.  I didnt get tested for three years at one point way back when I was fucking my HIV+ boyfriend raw, I just assumed I had it.  The problem is that fatalistic approach took a huge drag on other parts of my life.  After I finally got tested, and in my case it came back negative, I swore I would never do that again, because no matter what the result, not knowing is worse in almost every case.  At that point I also went into outreach and prevention.  I really hate giving bad news, but I can also tell you in most cases, even when people think they are HIV+, it comes back negative, non-reactive.  

My friend who just tested poz, was literally stunned when he heard the news... He had tested neg two weeks before, and he only tops! but it happens.  Less than a month later, his life hasn't changed one bit except a pill a day.  HIV is only a fate today if you let it be one.  Otherwise, you will have a regular life, and can fuck guys as long as you please bare!   

[6811283]

On 5/1/2018 at 6:12 PM, concerned1 said:

Even though I know I have the virus most likely deep within my bloodstream, hoovering up all my T-cells and eating away at my brain ....the urge...no...the NEED....to go and fuck more raw ass is overwhelming. I know that fucking anon bare ass is killing me. But I cannot stop. It is an addiction like no other. Raw hole just feels so good. And yet it is probably going to be the death of me. At least I'll have died from something that I loved.

You can choose to let sex be "the death of you" FOR YOURSELF. But if you really are, as you seem to think, poz and unmedicated, don't you maybe owe it to all the guys you are topping raw to make that choice for themselves too? Do you inform them that you think you are positive and not on meds?

That said, I think you're being overdramatic. You have no evidence that you're poz. There will always be anecdotes of total tops getting pozzed, like the ones we're seeing here, but they remain a small minority.

I don't know where you get the idea that the CDC is deliberately underestimating the chances of getting pozzed while topping. Their numbers almost always err on the side of OVERSTATING risk. For example, they insist on stating Prep is 90% effective even though the biggest research trials found it to be 99% effective if taken as directed, and there are only about 4 reported cases of Prep failure worldwide.

For your own sake, and the community's, grow a pair and get tested. There's really no downside to knowing. If you're neg (a very likely outcome) you can stop worrying, and you have the option of going on Prep. If you're poz and want to live a long, healthy life, you can start treatment. And if you are poz but really want to let the virus "hoover up your T-cells and eat your brain," you can go for it, with the thrill of knowing it's real, not fantasy. In any of those cases, you will be under MUCH less stress than you are now.

Get. Fucking. Tested.

[Guest BBBoyfromTN]

You’re overthinking this. If you’re cut there’s almost no risk at all. Fuck their brains out and be a total pig. I know guys who are all top who aren’t on Prep and only bareback and they’re fine. The only guy like that who did get pozzed was uncut and uncut are at higher risk for all STDs including HIV even if they’re top. 

[scorpio40]

First I'm married and don't fool around that often but have been exploring a little later in life. So on 8/18 Sunday just gone, I had a few drinks, I decided to go to a sex club in LA, have look, did the walk around, got into the vibe, saw some nice guys, had my dick sucked a couple of time but never cum.  Saw this older latin dude 40's walking around too, he was dad looking, handsome & tidy, we got into it made out for while, wanked and sucked each other, heat of the moment stuff, no words exchanged.  I'm worked up about to blow and he pulls out the poppers hits me with them, sends me whirling, he hits them and turns around and bends over grabs my cock and pushes it against his hole and pushes back on me and I slide in as he's well lubed up. It surprised me, it all happened fast, it wasn't rough, just regular pumping and I was worked ready to cum anyhow and it couldn't be more than two minutes and I blew inside him.  I don't know why I didn't put on a condom on & I'm down on myself as I didn't even ask him if he was neg or poz, so I have no idea. Stupidly, I just kissed said see ya, went and washed my cock off clean and gargled some oral rinse as well and left. I've been reading up the last 48 hours online about all stats and thoughts, it's worrying, even when it's short, single event unprotected anal sex and even as an average cut top, I know there is risk for exposure from fluids, the urthrea etc ... you know the rest.  I don't usually have unprotected sex, only oral and not that often, even thats a worry for me as my lower gum was a bit sore as my back wisdom tooth is giving me shit. Dumb play I guess and probably not a good day to decide to go to this club.  Since then I've had some bad anxiety,  I know I slipped up and like any lusting guy, just got into the moment too much and didn't check myself ...probably as I'd had may too many drinks. I'm still active with the wife, so I have to navigate this carefully as she doesn't now and I don't want to put her at risk and I will get tested. There is a few more experienced guys on this site than me so thoughts, advise is appreciated.   Thanks!

[spermy71]

Hey Scorpio,

I'd say there's good news and there's bad news.  The good news is that you are unlikely to get something on a single incident.  I've been to bathhouses multiple times, and I don't think I've ever gotten anything there, even though I've been an unprotected bottom.  As a top you are at a significantly lower risk.  The last study I heard suggested 1/5th the chance for the top compared to the bottom.  That said, as bad news, in the past year, I've had to be treated for HPV in the throat and ass, and I've had gonorrhoea and syphilis.  Some of those are harder to diagnose in women, and some have worse effects on women's bodies.  Also, the fact that the guy could take you so fast and was so lubed means that likely the lube was someone else's cum.  While that's hot (to me and to a lot of guys), it's a bigger risk. 

Personally, playing raw with other guys is not something that is optional for me.  If I have periods of time when I can't for whatever reason, I feel like life is not worth living.  For others it can be more optional.  You're going to want to choose how you proceed based on how important this is for you.  Can you realistically keep yourself away from this in the future?  Or is this a part of you that can't be denied?

The only way to keep your wife from any risk is to avoid having sex with her for a few weeks to a month, then get tested.  If you're determined to keep this from her, I'm not sure what you tell her to explain your abstinence.  If this part of you can't be denied, you have to have some communication with her.  It's a hard conversation, but "honey, I feel like I need to play outside our marriage to feel fulfilled" is a lot easier than "honey, I just gave you the clap", and nothing compared to "honey, I just gave you HIV".

It's just good planning to try to find someone to play with who plays a bit less.  It seems worth the time to find a more regular fuck buddy compared to playing at the bathhouse with a cumdump bottom like me (or your friend) who's already loaded.  If you need it to be anonymous, you might keep it to blowjobs?  Maybe your bathhouse has one of those ramps where the tops go up and the bottoms go down so that the cocksuckers don't have to kneel?  That way you could make sure one of us sneaky bottoms doesn't back up on you...

As far as asking if he is neg or poz, it's largely irrelevant.  If the guy who sat right down on your cock is negative, it's most likely because he's on PrEP.  If he thinks he's negative and he's not on PrEP, he's likely newly poz and highly contagious.  Likely a guy who is poz and has known for a long time is managing it with meds and is not contagious at all.  But there are people who are poz and have a high viral load.  And then there are guys who would lie to you in either direction, and a ton who don't know.  And there is the status of the lube in his ass that is likely someone else's cum, and there's no way to ask about that.  You're really concerned about the viral load, and this is just not something that you can assess with a one-word question.

In your situation, getting on PrEP yourself makes sense, as this is the one that your wife is least likely to forgive you for giving her. If you can't PrEP up and have to be absolutely safe, you are mostly OK with just getting blowjobs, and maybe sucking a bit not to completion.  For me sex doesn't count unless his cum goes inside me, so this isn't an option, and I have to be open about who I am and what I need. I wish you all the best in figuring out how to navigate this.

 

[Guest50]

I know it's possible to be infected from topping but it seems like those are the exceptions, and not the norm so I want to ask how many if you guys have actually tested poz from topping 100% of the time?

[NWUSHorny]

I'm almost sure I was pozzed by topping. To be fair though I did shove my uncut dick into literally thousands of cum filled holes. I also did allow an extremely limited number of raw dicks in my hole but not cum in me, like less than 20, and am of the opinion now that I do know what it feels like to be bred that I might have been stealthed once.

[BootmanLA]

20 minutes ago, NWUSHorny said:

I'm almost sure I was pozzed by topping. To be fair though I did shove my uncut dick into literally thousands of cum filled holes. I also did allow an extremely limited number of raw dicks in my hole but not cum in me, like less than 20, and am of the opinion now that I do know what it feels like to be bred that I might have been stealthed once.

I think this highlights a distinction that of which people should be aware.

When health officials opine on the difficulty of a man getting pozzed through topping, they're referring (in general) to a man fucking an HIV+ bottom and being directly infected by him. That is relatively hard to do (but not impossible, certainly; it generally requires there to be some sort of tear in the process, where blood comes in contact with the top's cock, either through a tear of his own, or by leaking up into the urethra, which is easier to infect).

But when the top is fucking a bottom (of any status) and there are already loads in that bottom's rectum, the calculus is changed. If those loads are all undetectable, pozzing is highly unlikely. But if any of those loads has a high viral content, then yes, pozzing is definitely possible. 

[downtownswallow]

No, I have not.  I do not knowingly fuck poz Tops.  I don't fuck strangers.  I'm selective and on pRep.  I see no reason to reduce the care I take to continue being negative.  I love and respect myself too much to allow that.

[Radium]

I was pozzed when I topped a friend of mine who was unaware he'd been infected. I'm circumcised. There was no blood, nor was our sex unusually energetic or violent. There wasn't any messiness.  

[hungry_hole]

On 7/24/2013 at 8:49 AM, wood said:

I was perusing some stats yesterday on HIV transmission and one of the most interesting ones I found was about heterosexual transmission from female to male. I always wondered how in Africa the transmission rate has remained so high even with regular condom use. One alarming stat I found was that when uncut men had sex with a woman who had an current sti infection or sore from any number of common STI's, the female to male infection rate was as high as 43% per single sex act.

I'm sure that in Africa heterosexual transmission is not completely heterosexual and if you followed the infections some guy bred another guy who then fucked a woman. Sex betwen men is not something they talk about openly

[Pozguyinchi]

My gifter is very dom and a total top. He got it from breeding. I joke with him now about how he says there is still not such thing as bad pussy. 

[BootmanLA]

9 hours ago, hungry_hole said:

I'm sure that in Africa heterosexual transmission is not completely heterosexual and if you followed the infections some guy bred another guy who then fucked a woman. Sex betwen men is not something they talk about openly

That may well be part of it. But another part is the sociology of many (certainly not all) African people, especially in rural areas.

It's not uncommon for a rural man to leave his wife (and kids, if any) in the rural village and travel to a bigger city to find work, sending home some of his pay to care for them. It's also not uncommon in such situations for the men to visit prostitutes - even if it's "casual" prostitution where he provides some support and she provides sex. On visits home, whatever he's picked up comes home with him.

Additionally, it's also not uncommon (if less talked about) for the women left behind to become dependent on a local man for "protection" and additional support. Such a man might have multiple women as "mistresses" (of a sort) from whom he extracts sex in exchange for them not being bothered by others.

In such situations, bugs like HIV (and other STIs, of course) can spread widely and easily. Remember that of the three factors that influence how fast/far an STI outbreak spreads (infectivity, prevalence, rate of partner change), with HIV the last is the most critical. Without partner change - going from one sexual partner to another - STIs have very limited ability to spread. If you have twenty people who all have sex with each other, but with no one outside the group, it's almost impossible for an STI to even penetrate the group dynamic. But all it takes is for one person to bring in an STI from outside, and that partner change among the group almost guarantees that everyone will get it.