My husband's killer

[leatherpunk16]

Some members may have heard me speak about my late husband, Mark. We had barely two years together before he was killed by his friend. Mark went to a party on March 16 2018 that this friend "Carl" was hosting. I was not invited. I knew he was going to a sex party with this guy, and they had a history of banging all night with no sleep. Several other unknown friends were going to be there. Mark was due home on the evening of the 18th, but did not return or send any messages. I figured he was having too great a time to deal with me. At nearly one in the afternoon on the 19th, I got a text message from his phone, but it wasn't from him. It was from Carl - Mark had a seizure the previous night and was rushed to a nearby hospital. 

Mark messaged me later in the day to say he was really sick and in the hospital. He had overdosed on amphetamines, but doesn't remember ingesting anything. When he was returned to me the next day, he couldn't really function: couldn't walk, was in constant pain, covered in bruises, shit himself like crazy, sweated through the bedsheets on the rare occasions he slept, and  couldn't keep anything in his stomach. After a week of this, he seemed to get better. His workplace fired him without a reason, so he lost his health insurance. His sickness was still popping back up, and I could see something was wrong with him, but he wouldn't go to the doctor. He collapsed quite suddenly on the morning of April 2nd, and never got back up. 

Months later, I found out the coroner declared the cause was "blood clot to the lungs". But I know better. Carl killed him. The drugs started that downward spiral. I also learned, in the meantime, that Carl is a meth dealer. He doesn't play unless he's methed out, and he once loaded up his now ex-fiance with drugs so much that his heart stopped, and when he was revived, the fiance was dumped in the alley behind the apartment. This is what kind of person Mark was associating with. He probably had no idea until it was too late. Mark wasn't a user - he hated that stuff. The police will not do anything about it. Most law enforcement still would rather not spend resources dealing with our subculture and investigating crimes within it. They are inclined to believe the coroner but won't pursue the drugging, of which there is documented proof from the hospital Mark was at on the 19th.

Here's my point to all of this: Carl has a porn movie that is to be released to the public this Friday. The sonofabitch should not get to resume his normal life after destroying mine. I am seeing this on the anniversary of Mark proposing to me. You can imagine how it makes me feel to learn of it on this day. What are my options?

1) Do nothing, say nothing. This is the easiest course, but nothing will change or happen. 

2) Go to Carl and ask him to tell me what the fuck happened at that party. He'll probably lie to me or ignore me. It's also possible that he won't speak to me without an attorney present, lest he incriminate himself.

3) Approach the studio, and ask them not to cast Carl anymore because of this. It's not a strong case, and it would look like I'm bitter about him making films when I don't get to. And it could hurt my chances of working for said studio.

What do I do??? I want Carl to be held accountable for what he did to my husband and me, and I don't know what course to take to achieve this end. Do I need a lawyer? Please tell me what I should do.

[Bicycledude]

2 hours ago, leatherpunk16 said:

Some members may have heard me speak about my late husband, Mark. We had barely two years together before he was killed by his friend. Mark went to a party on March 16 2018 that this friend "Carl" was hosting. I was not invited. I knew he was going to a sex party with this guy, and they had a history of banging all night with no sleep. Several other unknown friends were going to be there. Mark was due home on the evening of the 18th, but did not return or send any messages. I figured he was having too great a time to deal with me. At nearly one in the afternoon on the 19th, I got a text message from his phone, but it wasn't from him. It was from Carl - Mark had a seizure the previous night and was rushed to a nearby hospital. 

Mark messaged me later in the day to say he was really sick and in the hospital. He had overdosed on amphetamines, but doesn't remember ingesting anything. When he was returned to me the next day, he couldn't really function: couldn't walk, was in constant pain, covered in bruises, shit himself like crazy, sweated through the bedsheets on the rare occasions he slept, and  couldn't keep anything in his stomach. After a week of this, he seemed to get better. His workplace fired him without a reason, so he lost his health insurance. His sickness was still popping back up, and I could see something was wrong with him, but he wouldn't go to the doctor. He collapsed quite suddenly on the morning of April 2nd, and never got back up. 

Months later, I found out the coroner declared the cause was "blood clot to the lungs". But I know better. Carl killed him. The drugs started that downward spiral. I also learned, in the meantime, that Carl is a meth dealer. He doesn't play unless he's methed out, and he once loaded up his now ex-fiance with drugs so much that his heart stopped, and when he was revived, the fiance was dumped in the alley behind the apartment. This is what kind of person Mark was associating with. He probably had no idea until it was too late. Mark wasn't a user - he hated that stuff. The police will not do anything about it. Most law enforcement still would rather not spend resources dealing with our subculture and investigating crimes within it. They are inclined to believe the coroner but won't pursue the drugging, of which there is documented proof from the hospital Mark was at on the 19th.

Here's my point to all of this: Carl has a porn movie that is to be released to the public this Friday. The sonofabitch should not get to resume his normal life after destroying mine. I am seeing this on the anniversary of Mark proposing to me. You can imagine how it makes me feel to learn of it on this day. What are my options?

1) Do nothing, say nothing. This is the easiest course, but nothing will change or happen. 

2) Go to Carl and ask him to tell me what the fuck happened at that party. He'll probably lie to me or ignore me. It's also possible that he won't speak to me without an attorney present, lest he incriminate himself.

3) Approach the studio, and ask them not to cast Carl anymore because of this. It's not a strong case, and it would look like I'm bitter about him making films when I don't get to. And it could hurt my chances of working for said studio.

What do I do??? I want Carl to be held accountable for what he did to my husband and me, and I don't know what course to take to achieve this end. Do I need a lawyer? Please tell me what I should do.

My recommendation to you is that you should have a consultation with a GLAAD lawyer. They are tough litigators if it comes to that. They are pro bono for the community. 

[viking8x6]

That's horrible. Hugs to you. I agree with @Bicycledude's post. It's not clear what kind of proof you have that Carl was directly responsible, but if you have sufficient proof, you ought definitely to have a case for a wrongful death suit: [think before following links] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrongful_death_claim (note I'm not a lawyer and you should talk to one).

[PG1961Canada]

First of all... I am truly sorry (and kinda disgusted) to read this... my sympathies to you for enduring this mess.

I think you #1 isn't a good option.  You are doing your best to honor your partner. 

Do NOT try #2... you already know... he will likely lie.

And yes... #3 sounds like sour grapes, and studios are in it to make money... they likely won't want to get involved.

I like the GLAAD approach.  Take your story to them... especially if you get a no cost visit to explain your situation.

I wish you well and I hope you are able to get some resolution here..... for your partner Mark, and your own sanity my friend!

Peace.

[leatherpunk16]

I was not aware of the GLAAD option. Thank you for suggesting it.

I don't have any direct evidence that proves he did it. But it WAS his party, and his negligence caused that to happen. I can't get the medical report from the hospital he was at when he got drugged, so all I have is what Mark told me. Carl's ex-fiance told me about the meth dealing and how he was drugged up. It's all circumstantial evidence, but maybe someone with authority can dig up something physical. Not stories, but something they can SEE. At the very least, we can get Carl for the drug distribution and possibly possession. 

Something MUST be done. If I have a "loyalty mission", this is it. Get my head clear so I can move on with life. 

[NastyRigPig]

Sometimes you can get a civil judgement against someone when you can’t get a criminal judgement against them.  Criminal judgement the whole jury needs to agree a crime was committed, a civil judgement is a majority of jurors agree that a wrong has occurred. 
 

The question becomes, do you have the money to see it through, and would a judgement against Carl achieve anything financial?  

[leatherpunk16]

I do not have the money. Mark left me kinda destitute, a string of bad debts from his previous marriage.

I'm not looking for financial gain. I'm looking for peace and knowing that I did the right thing.

Edited December 17, 2019 by leatherpunk16

[NastyRigPig]

I think you’re going to find yourself frustrated if you seek out justice.  The system is geared towards moneyed interests, and any actions that you may be tempted to take would probably be construed as vigilante justice or harassment.   Check out GLAAD or Lambda legal, or see if there are other legal resources in your community.

[ErosWired]

It strikes me that you overlook a possible outcome if you were to confront Carl and demand information. You imagine that he might lie to you or ignore you. But this is a man whom you allege deals in drugs and nearly killed his own fiancée and dumped him in an alley - what makes you think that he, or people connected to him, would think twice about taking steps to ensure your silence?

Similarly, if you were to personally attempt to jeopardize his status by making claims to his studio, is he a man, in your opinion, likely to ignore that?

Feeling helpless to right a wrong or to fight an evil magnifies the pain of dealing with it, and I ache for you. But if you decide to take this on, be very sure you are prepared to become a target yourself. Better to follow the advice of those above and seek professional counsel.

[ejaculaTe]

ErosWired and NastyRigPig are pretty much spot on with their advice. I add a couple of my own observations.*

First, an example of what NastyRigPig mentioned about a civil suit is the OJ Simpson case - though he was acquitted of the murders, the Goldman family sued him and obtained a money judgment against Simpson.
 

Second, these civil actions have to be brought within a certain amount of time, the time being set by the relevant statute of limitations. Each state sets its own time limits, but the period is typically 2 to 3 years. My point here is that if you decide to do this, you need to get moving on it now, not next week. 

Third, the type of civil action that’s been mentioned is typically a wrongful death action. That action almost always requires some legal relationship to the dead person: for example, a son can sue because of his father’s death. The various states have various rules about who can file a wrongful death action, but the nature of your relationship may mean you’re not the person who can bring the claim.

Finally, litigation of this type can become very, very nasty. To say you could be dragged through the mud is an understatement. Everything about the two of you is fair game for the other side to explore in pre-trial proceedings (even if it isn’t introduced in any trial). 
 

The only way for you to get real advice is to consult a lawyer. And I can tell you right now that not many attorneys will be interested in taking the case. It’s factually complicated and the odds of success are, in my admittedly detached view, pretty low (like less than 10%). I feel for you, and in a reasonably perfect world, there’d be something that you could do, but the law isn’t always about justice.

Whatever you decide, good luck....

——-

*Not to brag on myself, but I practiced criminal law for nearly 30 years in one of the mid-Atlantic states. My comments are simply my observations based on my experience.

 

[NastyRigPig]

9 hours ago, leatherpunk16 said:

I do not have the money. Mark left me kinda destitute, a string of bad debts from his previous marriage.

I'm not looking for financial gain. I'm looking for peace and knowing that I did the right thing.

So what can you do to come to peace?   The Carl guy sounds like very bad news, but for two years it sounds like he’s taken part of you as well.   Now you need to concentrate on your next steps.  I am so sorry for your loss, but don’t let Carl take any more from you.

[leatherpunk16]

All very good advice. Thank you, gentlemen, for your counsel. I've had almost no one to talk to about this matter since it began, apart from friends and family who could only hold me and let me cry. 

You want to know what's really fucked up? Mark has a son, and he did not seem interested in pursuing any line of action, even prior to receiving the autopsy report. I've tried to get his support, but without success. It's like he doesn't care what happened to his dad. Based on what was earlier explained, the clincher is that he might be the only person who has a legal right to make any kind of claim to initiate the case. And that sucks most of all. I may have to forego my desire to punish Carl because the son won't take action.

I will try to locate a representative who knows more about the legal ramifications of this. Thank you for hearing my story.

[abm0011]

I have a couple questions and suggestions:

1. Were you legally married to your husband? In that case you are entitled to his medical records because you are the next of kin, right? Was an autopsy performed?

2. You MIGHT have a contributory negligence claim against Carl, but you have to act. Some attorneys might take your case as a contingency (in order words, you don't pay if you lose, but he taker a big chunk of the verdict if you do.) You should also consider the Carl's financial viability (if you win, CAN he pay?). There is no point to start a suit you cannot win, so ask an competent attorney. Time is of the essence though since the statue of limitation might run out very soon.

3. eja and pigrig are right. Lawsuits take a LONG time and might end up exhausting. Your own words might be used against you, including this post and other posts you made online. Your own sex life might end up on trial too.

4. You can always name and shame, if the facts are not in dispute. Who is this Carl? You said he has a porno coming out, but scant on the details. Is he a producer/director/performer? Is he well known in gay porn circles? Were his PnP habit well known to the community? Is he likely to sue for libel if you name him and shame him?

Edited December 18, 2019 by abm0011

[DarkroomTaker]

I feel for you, seriously I do. Its terrible not being able to do something for something that isn't right and leaving you heartbroken on so many levels. I really do not know what  I Would do in your situstion so many emotions.

I am concious that you may go through all this and get no real outcome.

Harsh to say, but please dont be offended,  Mark was an adult and had capacity and gave consent to make a decision, maybe an unwise decision, but he chose to make it.

Now if Mark was incapacitated at some point due to drugs and had lost capacity and unable to consent to taking further drugs, then that is s different story, but how would you prove that?

I think other posters are right to check out legally and see if there could be a case?

But please be mindful what you are writing on internet, it could backfire against you if it goes legal and possibly damage any legal challenge.

Sorry to be negative, but I do feel for your loss.

Take care....

[skinster]

Sorry for this being quite long. I've been back and forth about this as it reminded me of someone who was close to me at some time.

Personally-involved situations with a lot of emotional weight are not easy to process. Or to quantify an injury through an official channel. I'd start on hope dying last, but the scope and number of obstacles here is such that they can not be diminished just because you are so heavily emotionally vested into this. You need an opinion that separates emotional and factual sides, and there would be more than two in an area of view with a lot of half-tones to sift through. Try to walk through this slow.

Wrongful death (not a lawyer to evaluate) against 'Carl' you can suggest had Mark been pronounced dead by paramedics on scene, en route to the hospital or at the hospital. As soon as professional medical help gets involved, it is very easy for your opponent to suggest misdiagnosis, untimely treatment, incorrect dosage of whatever clever and a combination of multiples for variety. All Carl has to do is to raise doubt. A visit by paramedics would have been documented (note that for a later), a self-administered what/ever kept handy by Carl as a CYA before a quick conveyance to a said back alley would not be. Also, keep in mind that there is no antidote to meth. Usually it would be gastrointestinal decontamination as a first treatment. Medics would definitely know that. My 2 cents there would be that street meth most likely won't be just meth but a combination of nasty things, with varied levels of impurity. That will add a need for other antidotes to the picture. You really need a toxicology report to prove anything officially there (medic-to-medic, to cops, courts, etc). If the hospital did due diligence, they would have ordered it. But it won't show motive or intent or time lapse.

Since Mark was treated and released, liability for the outcome is now on the hospital how they have provided the treatment and whether it was appropriate to observed symptoms and test results. Or if a follow-up was ordered and achieved and the doctor was sober at the time. And that is no longer Carl with a dirty dose in hand if you've noticed. Now Mark's subsequent condition as described would suggest some level of physical trauma, either from options of sexual intercourse or from loss of motor skills due to ingested drug, so a reported blood clot dislodged from possible multiple falls does not sound odd as a cause of death. Even though you understand in hindsight that with motor skills intact the clot would have not been separated at that time from the vessel, etc, etc, and resulting circumstances would have been very, very different. And it's possibly Carl who tricked Mark along to those circumstances on purpose to ingest whatever through a spiked water bottle at his house. Or one of other people present there, with or without Carl's direct knowledge to such effect, who had done the same or offered. Or Mark by accident grabbed the closest water bottle being not empty to quench the thirst - explanations to horrendous consequence could be many. And neither could be true. And you move between an organizer to accessory to witness to bystander to collateral damage. All having very different liabilities. Negligence is the hardest thing to prove. Intent and motive there still being void. And that looks like the best you can hope for to clarify after all this time, again, trying to keep emotions away from it.

His son is dealing with grief in his own way. If you haven't bonded with him when Mark was still there and could facilitate, it's hard to expect it improve under current circumstances. He may have his own unresolved conflict with dad turning gay that he won't be willing to elaborate on to you.

And any law enforcement is usually skilled enough to recognize whether they can prove as documented or deduce an otherwise obviously guilty party, or that would be a hanger of a case going cold in a New York minute. They will not go willingly for the latter, or on a limb, regardless of how convinced you are on the liability of Carl & Co. So for your options -

1- is not your current scenario. You are doing something, even though it is mostly dealing with grief, as anniversary, same nasty people thrown back into your life, etc. You probably would need to expand on it for your own sake.
2- probably holds no real value for the future. However memorable or not was the event for Carl, I can't imagine him even acknowledging that he could have done something or everything differently that Mark would have not ended up in a hospital. As noble as it would be of you, that encounter has the slimmest chances of success or gratification at the hands of Carl IMHO. But I don't suggest that you forget about it altogether. Finding closure in my experience is extremely difficult.
3- businesses of all kinds will avoid internal grief of impropriety at all cost, regardless of morality clauses or righteousness. If they would be decent enough to listen to you about what happened to Mark and how Carl was possibly implicated there, it won't parlay into any possible future work for you. On a side note, are they the only house in town/style? Probably not.

What I am saying here is that there are many things in your story that can be turned upside down and inside out by a professional shyster hand with probably not a whole lot of effort. That doesn't mean that it would hurt any less. To make this effective for yourself you'd need to make it official through a formal discourse and eliminate doubt for 3rd parties. You won't be able to quantify emotions. Your version of events is only one side of the story. The courts will not see it as indisputable truth and a rock solid proof just because you've insisted on it. You will need a lot of skilled legal help if you decide to proceed so. In certain circles even an allegation of impropriety would signal to stay away from someone like Carl. Those circles are probably not very large when you talk about unsavory personalities in business of ill repute. But the biggest toll here to be is on you to have to relive all of it time and time again describing things yet again for other people. I can not claim to know that footprint on wellbeing. You've mentioned to be able to move on. Self-destructive behaviors (no pun for this place) usually are a sign to the contrary. I would suggest not to limit seeking help only to legal circles but to include as many emotional support options as possible. You will move forward whichever way you decide only when you have a sense of balance.