Created by a Trump supporter

[BootmanLA]

14 hours ago, ErosWired said:

But Trump was not born the thing he is - he was once a young child with the potential to become a good, decent, honest, admirable adult. His ruin is the work not of God, but of Man. And he is one of Man’s masterpieces of ruin.

That's almost certainly true, but it assumes that there isn't some physical difference in his makeup that led him onto this path.

As you know, we don't know what causes autism, but we have to assume it's not entirely caused by parental upbringing or other socio-environmental factors. There's presumably something physical/biochemical/whatever going on. Who's to say there isn't something similar in the brains of sociopaths?

[ErosWired]

7 hours ago, BootmanLA said:

That's almost certainly true, but it assumes that there isn't some physical difference in his makeup that led him onto this path.

As you know, we don't know what causes autism, but we have to assume it's not entirely caused by parental upbringing or other socio-environmental factors. There's presumably something physical/biochemical/whatever going on. Who's to say there isn't something similar in the brains of sociopaths?

Bootman, for God’s sake, whatever you do, don’t make any comments about Autism to Autistic people in real life. Every time you try to say something on the subject you stick your foot in it up to your knee.

Not only is Autism not entirely caused by parental upbringing, it’s not caused by parental upbringing at all, and that’s been debunked since the 90s. As to socioenvironmental factors, society doesn’t make us the way we are, it just makes us miserable for being this way. The degree to which environmental factors are involved is still in study.

And to suggest that there’s ‘something similar’ in the brains of sociopaths and people with Autism is an extraordinarily clumsy bit of rhetoric for someone with your ability.

Personally, I’m not inclined to give Trump a pass and say he’s just that way because of his genes. That’s the same as those apologists who say ‘That’s just Trump being Trump.’ To whom I reply: Exactly - and there’s no excuse for him.

[BootmanLA]

12 hours ago, ErosWired said:

Bootman, for God’s sake, whatever you do, don’t make any comments about Autism to Autistic people in real life. Every time you try to say something on the subject you stick your foot in it up to your knee.

Not only is Autism not entirely caused by parental upbringing, it’s not caused by parental upbringing at all, and that’s been debunked since the 90s. As to socioenvironmental factors, society doesn’t make us the way we are, it just makes us miserable for being this way. The degree to which environmental factors are involved is still in study.

And to suggest that there’s ‘something similar’ in the brains of sociopaths and people with Autism is an extraordinarily clumsy bit of rhetoric for someone with your ability.

Personally, I’m not inclined to give Trump a pass and say he’s just that way because of his genes. That’s the same as those apologists who say ‘That’s just Trump being Trump.’ To whom I reply: Exactly - and there’s no excuse for him.

With all due respect, I'll post on what topics I choose, thank you very much.

My point - which you seem to be overlooking in your zeal to paint me as ignorant on autism - is that just as *one* known issue in ability to navigate interpersonal relations (for lack of a better generic term for it) - autism - is not caused by upbringing, there's no proof that another - narcissistic sociopathy - was solely caused in his case by "man". For all we know, his issues, manifest since his childhood, are innate to his wiring. They may or may not have been exacerbated by his upbringing, but it's interesting to note that his older brother, who was subject to even more of the same pressures Donald was, chose instead to abandon the family business and basically drank himself to death, while one of his sisters went to law school and became a respected judge (the other two siblings are less well documented publicly, but that alone suggests they didn't turn out the same way he did, despite all being raised by the same parents in the same house at more or less the same time.

So I'm not even hinting that autism is caused by parental upbringing - if you'd read my post more carefully you might have realized that, just as you might have realized I'm not saying society makes autistic people that way. I'm saying that just as we don't know the cause of ONE, we shouldn't ASSUME the cause of the other. As you did.

[ErosWired]

25 minutes ago, BootmanLA said:

With all due respect, I'll post on what topics I choose, thank you very much.

I didn’t tell you not to post. I said don’t run your mouth in front of real-live Autistic people, because what you say is insulting as fuck and you don’t even realize it. I’m not going to wade into a debate over your semantics. I’m just telling you, as a member of the marginalized community in question, that your comments are offensive to people like me, and you have made comments of a similar nature in the past, based largely on assumptions and a lack of understanding. If you don’t wish to be offensive, you must consider your comments in this vein more carefully. If you don’t give a shit, by all means show your ass however you please. I will react as you may expect.

[onlyraw]

Unless that whole news show was also fake- I would be asking … are you sure the video was produced by tithe Onion???

[NWUSHorny]

1 hour ago, onlyraw said:

Unless that whole news show was also fake- I would be asking … are you sure the video was produced by tithe Onion???

The MAGA have pretty much killed satyr. The Onion can't compete with "real" QAnon crazy stories.

[tallslenderguy]

On 1/12/2024 at 6:46 PM, onlyraw said:

Unless that whole news show was also fake- I would be asking … are you sure the video was produced by tithe Onion???

"The video, which Mr. Trump first posted to Truth Social last Friday and then played before taking the stage at several rallies in Iowa over the weekend, is called “God Made Trump.” In starkly religious, almost messianic tones, it depicts the former president as the vessel of a higher power sent to save the nation."

[think before following links] https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/11/us/politics/trump-god-video-pastors-iowa.html

 

[hntnhole]

Millions honor the concept of God.  Many more millions world-wide detest that mistake-of-humanity.  The fact that there are so-called "religious" persons who can stomach - let alone accept/endorse this merde is beyond all understanding. 

Maybe "God" is tired of it too, and sending the most bitter cold weather to Iowa tomorrow.  Maybe things are a bit slow in "Heaven" these days, and "God" is going to send some folks to that warm place with the 7 rings ....... which makes more sense that anything in the above.  

[Cubbtm4poz]

What is scary is that he's leading in the parties as the Republican front runner....I just changed my party to Republican so I can vote in the primary and vote for Nikki Haley...II know some are thinking I just be crazy but I feel if more people get out and support Haley then maybe this will shake up the Republican party and get him out as their candidate...

[tallslenderguy]

14 hours ago, Cubbtm4poz said:

What is scary is that he's leading in the parties as the Republican front runner....I just changed my party to Republican so I can vote in the primary and vote for Nikki Haley...II know some are thinking I just be crazy but I feel if more people get out and support Haley then maybe this will shake up the Republican party and get him out as their candidate...

Given Biden's lack of support, that doesn't strike me as a "crazy" way to use your vote.

Interesting MIT study done prior to Trumps election offers some insight i think:

"This study investigated the cognitive processing of true and false political information. Specifically, it examined the impact of source credibility on the assessment of veracity when information comes from a polarizing source (Experiment 1), and effectiveness of explanations when they come from one's own political party or an opposition party (Experiment 2). These experiments were conducted prior to the 2016 Presidential election. Participants rated their belief in factual and incorrect statements that President Trump made on the campaign trail; facts were subsequently affirmed and misinformation retracted. Participants then re-rated their belief immediately or after a delay. Experiment 1 found that (i) if information was attributed to Trump, Republican supporters of Trump believed it more than if it was presented without attribution, whereas the opposite was true for Democrats and (ii) although Trump supporters reduced their belief in misinformation items following a correction, they did not change their voting preferences. Experiment 2 revealed that the explanation's source had relatively little impact, and belief updating was more influenced by perceived credibility of the individual initially purporting the information. These findings suggest that people use political figures as a heuristic to guide evaluation of what is true or false, yet do not necessarily insist on veracity as a prerequisite for supporting political candidates."

[think before following links] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5383823/

 

heu·ris·tic

/hyo͝oˈristik/

adjective

1. enabling someone to discover or learn something for themselves.

"a “hands-on” or interactive heuristic approach to learning"

2. COMPUTING

proceeding to a solution by trial and error or by rules that are only loosely defined.

noun

(source: Oxford languages)

 

[ErosWired]

27 minutes ago, tallslenderguy said:

although Trump supporters reduced their belief in misinformation items following a correction, they did not change their voting preferences.  […] yet do not necessarily insist on veracity as a prerequisite for supporting political candidates."

This ^ is what I find so deeply disturbing, and what I would not have believed true of Americans prior to the arrival of Trump on the political scene. It staggers me that so many of my countrymen simply don’t care how bad a man is that takes power, as long as he’s their man.

I hate politics and politicians. All of them, both sides. There’s nothing honest about them; deception is their stock-in-trade. Trump is exacerbating it all in the worst possible way because he clearly, obviously, patently suffers from acute mental illness*. But this is an observation I’ve personally made about conservatives ever since I was a child listening to my maternal grandfather (a staunch Republican) rant about welfare - there is a certain mindset among conservatives that asks, ‘Why should anyone else get more than me? Why should anyone get something I don’t get?’ And thus anyone who receives anything they perceive as unearned, particularly if they themselves feel underrewarded for their work, then that person is unworthy of what they get. By extension, this philosophy applies to the whole social safety net provided by society. By further extension, all government, because taxes may benefit others in way the conservative considers undeserving. Extended further, Socialism as a concept becomes an evil, extended further, anything proposed to be done for the common good becomes suspect, and resisted, even though, by definition, the conservative would benefit as well. Because at its root, there is a self-defeating self-centeredness that drives the conservative, that ultimately concludes, “If I can’t have it, nobody’s going to have it.”

And thus we see the hardline faction in the House, essentially acting on that precise impulse, to the cheers of their suffering constituents.

And here we have Trump, crying, “They cheated you out of what you deserve, like they always do! Give me power! Make me your King! Heads will roll! I AM YOUR RETRIBUTION!”

No fucking wonder they love him. He’s the King of Selfishness.

*No professional in mental health will publicly say the obvious, nor should they, because they have not examined the patient to make a formal diagnosis. But I helped mentally ill people through peer support for 18 years, and…yeah, he’s got it bad. I’m certainly not qualified to diagnose, but there are clear flags for sociopathy (possibly psychopathy), narcissistic personality disorder, borderline personality disorder, and/or other comorbid complications. He also shows signs of delusional thought patterns, and multiple sources have documented a lack of impulse control and anger control. One listens to people on the news talking about Nikki Haley suggesting that Trump may be mentally unstable - for fuck’s sake, he’s nuttier than peanut brittle, and everybody - everybody - knows it.

What I find so tragic is that so many people simply don’t care.

[NWUSHorny]

There is another element to the Trump supporters support, he is the stereotypical hard sell salesman, and they see him as using those skills to push their agenda. It isn't at all effective on someone like myself that intentionally avoided doing business  e\with businesses that attempt to use a hard sell in their general marketing, and who has long been accustom to walking out on hard sellers, usually letting them know what I think of their unethical business practices as loudly as I can while exiting their place of business. What Trump's rise to political power has taught me is that those techniques, no matter how close to outright theft are very economically viable. 

I've also long held the opinion that our justice system is way to lenient on criminal sales and marketing fraud, for the good of both our economy and culture. Donald Trump's entire business and political  career epitomizes this.

Edited January 24 by NWUSHorny

[hntnhole]

19 hours ago, Cubbtm4poz said:

if more people get out and support Haley then maybe this will shake up the Republican party and get him out as their candidate...

As we now know (post NH primary), that is about the farthest thing from the R's minds.  What's also beginning to creep into the political conversations is, the Trumpanzee* seems to be having a few cognitive issues of his own these days.  Reminds me of that old saying kids use:  Starts with "sticks & stones ....." 

*credit: Bootman (he comes up with the best insults re: HairFuror.)  I'm no slouch at it, but he's got me beat !!

[hntnhole]

4 hours ago, ErosWired said:

This ^ is what I find so deeply disturbing, and what I would not have believed true of Americans prior to the arrival of Trump on the political scene. It staggers me that so many of my countrymen simply don’t care how bad a man is that takes power, as long as he’s their man

Agreed.  It's the triumph of UnReason ... the truth matters not one bit ... reason no longer exists ... some actually believe(!) that this corpulent bag of shit has been sent by their deity to "rescue" the country.  There just isn't any kind of reasonable conversation to be had with this crowd.  One of the terrors these folks believe in is the Anti-Christ - and they're following him with no shred of resemblance to what the man really is.  If I were anti-Religious before, I'm doubly so lately.  

[PozBearWI]

Trump uses repetition to sell.  He classically practices the adage "Keep repeating until they believe it".  For me that behavior begs the question "what is he selling that he has to be in my face every 15 minutes?".  I am tired of his noise.