IMPORTANT: Big changes coming to hookup sites and apps

[Guest]

The card companies are bowing to the far right. It’s ridiculous, and they aren’t considering what kind of liability they are opening themselves up to once they set themselves up as police - which will also set them up for a barrage of legal issues when people start holding them accountable. By doing this, they think they’ve taken some kind of righteous moral stand, but all they’ve done is put themselves in the firing line.

These are the same pressures from the powerful Christian Right that have turned Sony into a joke because they now censor third party software on their platforms, while still charging full price for a product that’s unlabeled as partial. And all the while not applying the same rules to their own software. 

But these types of sites will never disappear. People are livid that all their content has been deleted from sites like Pornhub and xHamster and as a result those sites will lose a lot of their customer base.

There is now a market both for free or community hosted sites for this content, and for cryptocurrency to finally find a real niche, as others have said. All someone has to do is make it as easy to use as your credit card (which it isn’t today). 

Money talks. The Right is wielding the power of the Banks; the same ones that are attacking us using our own money. 

Take it away from them. Don’t use services that try to dictate their morality on you. We are now on a very slippery slope.

[parvenu]

sounds like orwellian bullshit, they need to all go crypto

[KentuckyCucker]

On 4/27/2021 at 9:41 AM, rawTOP said:

This is just a heads up since we all depend in one way or another on hookup sites and apps which in turn depend on paid memberships…

Mastercard is changing the rules (and Visa is sure to follow suit). In the near future any site with adult content will now have to…

1) Validate the identity of all users who upload content. This means you will need to upload government ID to every hookup site/app you use and they will need to validate that the ID is authentic and belongs to you.

2) Require anyone uploading adult content to obtain and maintain WRITTEN consent and age verification for each person in the image. This means to upload a picture of your dick or your ass you'll need to sign a form consenting to both having the picture taken (even though you took it) and having it uploaded (even though you uploaded it). And you'll need to sign a form verifying your ID at the time the pic was taken and save a copy of your ID in your files. You then need to maintain those documents for as long as the pic is on the site. If the pic contains another person, then you need all those documents for them as well.

Now it's possible the sites could require that you be the only person in the images you upload and that they have you digitally sign consent and age verification documents at the time of the upload (you will already have uploaded your ID). But what if they have data breach and a hacker gets all that information? Do you really want your name, address, etc. made public along with your X-rated pics? Unless you have an exposure fetish that's sorta a nightmare scenario.

This means paid hookup site/app memberships are a thing of the past. That may sound great, but the sites/apps depend on that revenue. And the new rules require they do a lot of work - verifying your identity and verifying the legality of each image you upload. I don't see how they can survive. At a bare minimum they'll stop sponsoring events, membership prices will go up (to cover the additional staff needed to comply with the rules and the members who leave their sites/apps). It's not going to be pretty.

For years now the credit card companies have dictated what adult content you see. There is adult content that's legal that they don't approve of that you never see. There's a literal war going on against porn and it's the cause of all these changes. It started a few years ago with states like Utah passing measures saying porn was a public health hazard. (There's no scientific evidence to support that claim). And then they progressed to claiming that all sex work is "sex trafficking" (when that's not the case at all). Then they went after PornHub for enabling sex trafficking when Facebook's issues with sex trafficking are literally like a thousand times greater. (PornHub had major legal issues, but they were with piracy, not sex trafficking.) Then they appeared before legislators in Canada (where Mindgeek is headquartered) trying to get the owners of Mindgeek arrested. (Mindgeek owns most of the straight porn industry, including PornHub, as well as significant parts of gay porn - like Sean Cody, Men.com and Reality Dudes.) The law enforcement folks who were called kept repeating that they're not aware of any laws that were broken and hence couldn't arrest anyone. Then there were calls by the most extreme agitators to actually kill the owners of Mindgeek. (Which sounds a lot like one of ISIS' "fatwahs"). And now the (under construction) home of one of the owners of MindGeek just got burned to the ground by an arsonist, which means the calls to kill the owners need to be taken extremely seriously.

In the middle of all that the anti-porn folks have been pressuring Visa and Mastercard to be stricter with adult content. MindGeek deleted 80% of the content on PornHub, XTube, etc. just to please Mastercard. And now Mastercard is going further and getting stricter with adult content. The straight folks don't really care what happens to hookup/dating sites. Most of the dating sites on the straight side of the business are fraudulent (none of girls actually exist - they're all chat bots). And the few legit ones could probably go PG-13. But that's not the case with LGBT+ sites. We're not going to join a PG-13 site.

The bottom line here is that sex and porn are political. The reason why I had a very hard line against the pro-Trump folks last fall was because they're the ones going after porn and the gay community. The whole anti-porn thing is wrapped up in the QAnon belief that there's a huge amount of child sex trafficking. The hysteria over that is what's driving all this. I have a niece who feels like she needs to wear a gun on her otherwise her kids will be snatched at any moment and sex trafficked. She's college-educated and both of her parents are scientists. It's just bonkers.

But the point is politics matters. Who you vote for matters. Whether you vote matters. Whether you write your elected officials matters.

Thanks

[valldelxeno]

I hope it doesn't pan out like this...it really would be awful, I don't see what way of meeting gays could be more tailored to my needs...I dislike bars because you can't hear people and I can't dance. Plus I'm not great looking so it is kind of hard when there's a restricted amount of people (by venue capacity), I depend mostly on guys that find me exotic and I will definitely have more come across my profile on a hookup app than in a bar, the sheer volume of people is what does it. 

 

I, for one, however, would gladly be on a hookup app that is PG-13. I mean, I would prefer being able to exchange nudes, but I don't really care much about the body other than him being approximately average size and preferably having a big dick. The only bit I really care to see beforehand is the face. I'm hoping there are others like me...

[dickluva]

As a small business owner and stockholder of banks, I do not support tyrants. My business does not accept Mastercard as payment. The bank I use=  USBank of Minnesota, has won awards from the GLBTQ community. I do not like being told how to run my business. I did not like MC fees. I do not think my policy costs me money. I accept cash only. If their are customers who only want to use a CC, I'm OK without their $. I have spent thousand of dollars fighting Saint Louis legal policies. I have won many battles, and lost a few too. I am still glad I fought the battles. I just checked CCBill will accept a check for payment, CCBill is BBRT processor  $. BTW, Saint Louis MO city hall has not elected a Republican in like 60 years. I don't just blame the R's for the tyranny I experience. The discrimination I have experienced in my life, frequent and hurtful, came from other gay men and lesbians. Freedom ain't free. While City Hall forced my business to close during the Covid crisis, BLM vandalized our business, while we paying our many minority employees to stay home. It was not the Christian Right that cost me big money. I will continue to fight against tyranny. Thanks for reading this.

[Guest takingdeepanal]

@rawTOP - silly question, I know - but if everything goes to an app-based system, wouldn't the power to block the app be then placed solely in the hands of the boss of whoever owns the Operating System tied to your phone? recon NKP and BBRT don't have apps (and the latter will NEVER be allowed to develop one as there's mention of both barebacking and drug use).

 

[barebackbears]

On 4/29/2021 at 8:43 AM, rawTOP said:

he was thinking that since the apps (Grindr, Scruff, etc.) satisfy Apple's content guidelines, that they might not be considered "adult content or services". In which case they'd be exempt from Mastercards rules

I am not a lawyer, but based on what I read here, I think:

This is unlikely to affect iOS/Android native apps because the app stores forbid sexually explicit content anyway.

This could affect sites that rely on cc:bill and other factoring services.
This could affect large commercial sites like manhunt.
This could affect adult content producers like RFC.
This could affect adult content publishers like OnlyFans.

This is unlikely to affect websites or web apps that are either free to use, or rely on an advertising model (including Twitter), unless 47 USC § 230 is revoked on account of Google, Facebook, and Twitter's engagement in censorship, propaganda, and gaslighting.

 

[barebackbears]

On 4/27/2021 at 8:41 AM, rawTOP said:

Mastercard is going further and getting stricter with adult content. The straight folks don't really care what happens to hookup/dating sites. Most of the

Do you consider PornHub to be a hookup/dating site? 

Because Mastercard's rules could decimate the Internet porn business, but dating sites would not be affected per se, because pornography is not fundamental to the business model. 

Thus I'm confused how a conversation about a threat to the porn business gets conflated as a threat to the profile/chat business.

[hairyone]

Debit cards?  They are used by some Medical Marijuana Centers since they can't use credit cards.  Sure, there's an "ATM Fee" but that's only a couple of extra bucks.

Or what about the other cashApps such as Venmo?  I understand there could be less protections on loss for both the "seller" and "buyer" but hopefully that would only be a small percentage.

Checking account deduction? The popper seller, Jenray/AromaBoy, uses GreenPay eCheck for direct checking account deduction.  I think that's all they accept; no credit cards.

Or, just don't allow picture/video posting.  Just keep allowing links and let the other sites work it out.

Thanks for all you do for this site, RawTOP.

[tallslenderguy]

There are religious organizations who believe gay people are "an abomination to God."  They are convinced, even in 2021, that they are doing "Gods" bidding to make who we are illegal. It may be hard for someone who has never experienced this. I was arrested in 1998 and charged with a felony for asking an undercover vice cop who was pretending to cruise if he wanted to fuck me (a hundred year old law was used). That's not that long ago guys, and there are plenty of people who are fighting to outlaw us in 2021. 

Check out this list of groups, then google their actual home sites if you doubt.  

[think before following links] https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/intelligence-report/2010/18-anti-gay-groups-and-their-propaganda

It's not MC who is making the decision to come after gays. Follow the money. MC and credit card companies want our money, they don't really care how they get it. They are being pressured, and bowing to the pressure, of outside groups. Check out this BBC aritcal .

"A letter seen by the BBC, signed by more than 10 campaigners and campaign groups, says porn sites "eroticise sexual violence, incest, and racism" and stream content that features child sexual abuse and sex trafficking.

One leading site, Pornhub, said "the letter [was] not only factually wrong but also intentionally misleading."

Mastercard told the BBC they were investigating claims made in the letter on pornography sites and would "terminate their connection to our network" if illegal activity by a cardholder was confirmed.

The letter was sent to 10 major credit card companies, including the "Big Three", Visa, MasterCard and American Express. The signatories from countries including the UK, US, India, Uganda and Australia have called for the immediate suspension of payments to pornographic sites.

The signatories of the letter include the anti-pornography non-profit group the National Center on Sexual Exploitation (NCOSE) in the US, and other faith-led or women and child rights' advocacy groups."

[think before following links] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-52543508

[tallslenderguy]

i wrote this today on another thread about xtube being shut down, you can check it out on that thread if you want all the live links/resources. 

"XTube, a prominent pornographic streaming platform, is shutting down as its parent company faces mounting accusations that it facilitated sex trafficking on its subsidiary sites. The platform announced this week that it was disabling video and photo uploads as it prepared to close down on Sept. 5"

The Justice Defense Fund  is the force behind the XTube closure (these guys have done a great job sanitizing their site and hiding their religious underpinnings)

It's not a clear cut topic, and i do not doubt there are illegal things that happen with XTube. By the same token there are illegal things that happen in churches too, would they cry foul if a large organization wanted to close churches down because of some of the illegal activities that go on there?  i write that because i smell the religious right in this activity. Though they are getting sneaky and learning to hide who they are and couch their agenda in terms like "sexploitation," their definition of what sex should be is a lot narrower than they present to the general public. Laila Mickelwait is the Founder and CEO of the Justice Defense Fund the force behind it, which claims to be a non-religious, non partisan organization. Yet, is its head and founder being honest and open about her agenda? 

A quick google on Laila Mickelwait provided this : 

"In February 2020, the organization's Director of Abolition, Laila Mickelwait, launched a petition to shut down the adult website Pornhub. Mickelwait's #Traffickinghub campaign was co-sponsored the National Center on Sexual Exploitation, an anti-pornography organization formerly known as Morality in Media. By September, the campaign had gained over two million signatures, and on December 10, following an opinion column by New York Times columnist Nicholas Kristof alleging the site was being used to share sex abuse videos,[5] Visa and Mastercard stopped allowing Pornhub to accept credit card transactions.[6] Shortly after, the Canadian Parliament began hearings to investigate the allegations against PornHub.[7]"

"The organization originally developed out of a weekly prayer group founded in 2007 by Benjamin Nolot, a filmmaker and member of the charismatic Christian International House of Prayer. Nolot is currently the CEO of the organization. Exodus Cry says it is no longer directly affiliated with the church, but that it is faith-based and does offer prayer instruction on its website.[3][4] As of 2018, Exodus Cry was listed as a "related tax-exempt organization" on tax filings submitted by the International House of Prayer and has partnered with the church for campaigns since then."

Here's an article in the Daily Beast  that exposes the religious roots and complete intent behind their efforts:

"Mickelwait’s case against Pornhub hinges on several real incidents of exploitation—most prominently, a class-action lawsuit against the amateur porn operation Girls Do Porn, which The Daily Beast covered extensively last year and which resulted in $12.8 million in damages being awarded to the victims. But the campaign’s claims about itself are less accurate. While Traffickinghub presents itself as “a non-religious, non-partisan effort,” the organizing force behind it is neither. Mickelwait’s employer—and the organization running the Traffickinghub campaign—is Exodus Cry, a fringe Evangelical group with far-right ties “prayed” into existence in a Missouri church, with the goal of abolishing the commercial sex industry entirely."

i was raised in the religious right and was under their thumb for much of my life. Getting free of that evil force was a torturous process for me and many others, and this has their scent all over it. Make no mistake, these guys also believe gays are going to burn in hell and back in the late 20th century were trying to pass and enforce 100 year old laws that would jail gay people for having sex with each other.  I know this is real, i lived it, and it is fucked up. 

Reverse it. Lets say someone decided they wanted to shut down the evil church and tried to shut down the Church of Christ because of what Jim Jones did? Of any number of other christian leaders who have broken the law (and there are plenty of them, ironically, many who have been caught in sexploitaion). Do a google on sexploitation in the church and see how long that has been going on and how widespread that has been. 

Why isn't The Justice Fund going after the church?

[analluv27]

On 8/9/2021 at 7:01 PM, tallslenderguy said:

i wrote this today on another thread about xtube being shut down, you can check it out on that thread if you want all the live links/resources. 

"XTube, a prominent pornographic streaming platform, is shutting down as its parent company faces mounting accusations that it facilitated sex trafficking on its subsidiary sites. The platform announced this week that it was disabling video and photo uploads as it prepared to close down on Sept. 5"

The Justice Defense Fund  is the force behind the XTube closure (these guys have done a great job sanitizing their site and hiding their religious underpinnings)

It's not a clear cut topic, and i do not doubt there are illegal things that happen with XTube. By the same token there are illegal things that happen in churches too, would they cry foul if a large organization wanted to close churches down because of some of the illegal activities that go on there?  i write that because i smell the religious right in this activity. Though they are getting sneaky and learning to hide who they are and couch their agenda in terms like "sexploitation," their definition of what sex should be is a lot narrower than they present to the general public. Laila Mickelwait is the Founder and CEO of the Justice Defense Fund the force behind it, which claims to be a non-religious, non partisan organization. Yet, is its head and founder being honest and open about her agenda? 

A quick google on Laila Mickelwait provided this : 

"In February 2020, the organization's Director of Abolition, Laila Mickelwait, launched a petition to shut down the adult website Pornhub. Mickelwait's #Traffickinghub campaign was co-sponsored the National Center on Sexual Exploitation, an anti-pornography organization formerly known as Morality in Media. By September, the campaign had gained over two million signatures, and on December 10, following an opinion column by New York Times columnist Nicholas Kristof alleging the site was being used to share sex abuse videos,[5] Visa and Mastercard stopped allowing Pornhub to accept credit card transactions.[6] Shortly after, the Canadian Parliament began hearings to investigate the allegations against PornHub.[7]"

"The organization originally developed out of a weekly prayer group founded in 2007 by Benjamin Nolot, a filmmaker and member of the charismatic Christian International House of Prayer. Nolot is currently the CEO of the organization. Exodus Cry says it is no longer directly affiliated with the church, but that it is faith-based and does offer prayer instruction on its website.[3][4] As of 2018, Exodus Cry was listed as a "related tax-exempt organization" on tax filings submitted by the International House of Prayer and has partnered with the church for campaigns since then."

Here's an article in the Daily Beast  that exposes the religious roots and complete intent behind their efforts:

"Mickelwait’s case against Pornhub hinges on several real incidents of exploitation—most prominently, a class-action lawsuit against the amateur porn operation Girls Do Porn, which The Daily Beast covered extensively last year and which resulted in $12.8 million in damages being awarded to the victims. But the campaign’s claims about itself are less accurate. While Traffickinghub presents itself as “a non-religious, non-partisan effort,” the organizing force behind it is neither. Mickelwait’s employer—and the organization running the Traffickinghub campaign—is Exodus Cry, a fringe Evangelical group with far-right ties “prayed” into existence in a Missouri church, with the goal of abolishing the commercial sex industry entirely."

i was raised in the religious right and was under their thumb for much of my life. Getting free of that evil force was a torturous process for me and many others, and this has their scent all over it. Make no mistake, these guys also believe gays are going to burn in hell and back in the late 20th century were trying to pass and enforce 100 year old laws that would jail gay people for having sex with each other.  I know this is real, i lived it, and it is fucked up. 

Reverse it. Lets say someone decided they wanted to shut down the evil church and tried to shut down the Church of Christ because of what Jim Jones did? Of any number of other christian leaders who have broken the law (and there are plenty of them, ironically, many who have been caught in sexploitaion). Do a google on sexploitation in the church and see how long that has been going on and how widespread that has been. 

Why isn't The Justice Fund going after the church?

Simple, money. The religious right generate a vast amount of income which they use to influence laws and legislation. I do believe in God but churches shouldn't be tax exempt if they go funding politicians 

[Whitebutt]

On 8/12/2021 at 1:36 AM, analluv27 said:

Simple, money. The religious right generate a vast amount of income which they use to influence laws and legislation. I do believe in God but churches shouldn't be tax exempt if they go funding politicians 

Religion must be one of the most profitable businesses on earth. How else did all the religious societies in the world (Christian, Muslim, Hindu, Buddism etc) get so filthy rich? They should all be taxed like any other business!

[Oldercumslut]

Haven’t kept up with this.   What’s the current status?

[ellentonboy]

I am relatively new to BZ so I am curious as to the current status regarding hookup sites and identification, as well as acceptance of credit cards.  I know years back DudesNude asked me to send a photo holding a number they supplied me.  Once I did that I was allowed to post but I really didn't consider it a hook up site.  I can say I currently use a site, and have done so for years, that contains x rated photos and does ask about drug usage.  That site has never asked me to prove my identity and does currently accept my Visa card if I want to upgrade to Premium (allowing for unlimited messages).  So how is it that site is still allowed to operate if they really haven't verified who I am.  They accept payment from me and I haven't received any notification that I needed to provide a state of federally issued ID to continue on their site. 

So can I expect to hear from them in the near future?  Just curious if other BZ members have had a similar experience (or non-experience as in my case)?