tallslenderguy

One of the thoughts this "food" evoked: Do some cumdumps/bottoms help support and perpetrate the self absorbed/immature/inconsiderate attitudes of some? i don't think it's a black or white issue, but how many bottoms/cumdumps openly advertise and project that they are and want to be treated as "worthless" or "merely a fuckhole," "an object to be used" or "trash" or "______________." i think it's complicated. One can speculate on all sorts of reasons why some get into the kind of Top/bottom dynamic where Top is considered superior and bottom inferior. i think a lot of those who do this are often trying to meet a need that is more subtle than the manifest or projected desire. For instance, i think a lot of guys indulge in role play, but that is not the same as them believing they are actually the equivalent of the role they are playing. So, one may play the role of "trash" in an attempt to evoke a sort of primal lust from a potential experience, they want to get fucked by the TrashMan lol? Or on the other side, a guy may assume an attitude of superior indifference or swagger, playing a role as well because He needs/desires His cock and seed and associated lust to be needed/desired. If all He needed/desired was an "object" or "trash," a fleshjack could do. The goal of both is essentially the same: to elicit desire/need from the other for their own particular need/desire. i don't think of Top/bottom as superior/inferior, but i think that is where part of the problem derives. If one thinks of their self as inferior, worthless, trash, where's the surprise when a certain number of guys treat them as such? Again, i don't think this is a simple question or answer. i think a lot of what is real about who and how we are gets blurred behind the roles and labels we use and assume, that we end up not seeing or losing touch with the real reasons behind our desires, serving the labels instead of just using them as a means to attempt to communicate what is really there, what is really felt, what is really wanted/needed.

hntnhole mirrors several of my thoughts and feelings on this one. At the end of the day, i don't really want this kind of guys seed inside of me. Getting bred for me is more than just me getting sex, it's about both of us getting our desires/needs met. To me, the connection is way to important to reduce and denigrate it the way some do. When a Man has His orgasm inside of me, to me He is having His pleasure, desire, need inside of me. There's a connection, transference, impartation of Himself into me. The lying, fake flakes... i don't want them or their seed inside of me. i think hntnhole is right, it all adds up and ends up hurting them more than us. We are better off without them. they sully our environment, definitely a pollutant. Like hntnhole, i've gotten to a place where i try to avoid the places that seem to be the most polluted with them.

"Bathhouses as Communal Brothels" Not to me. i think i understand the point being made, but it's a stretch to far for me. Paying for an opportunity to have sex (e.g. a bathhouse), is not the same as paying the individual i am having sex with as a requisite to having sex with Him (whether directly or through an intermediary like a pimp or "brothel"). A vital element of sex for me is an expression of mutual desire/need. I.e., each person involved wants/needs the other persons need/desire for fulfillment. While an argument might be made that a sex worker 'loves' his work, from my side, i would not be able to get around my aversion to the notion he is only, or primarily, having sex with me for money. Lol, i won't even have sex with a versatile guy unless i am confident he really wants a total bottom at the time. Why? Because His fulfillment is connected to mine, and if i feel i cannot honestly give Him what He wants/needs, i'd rather go without. my perception of a bathhouse is it's a place where guys go to get there sexual needs/desires met, not their monetary desires/needs. All are paying for the opportunity, neither party is being financially remunerated. If i thought someone was being paid to have sex with me, even as a gift, i'd pass.

Our responses crossed in the ether, but i wondered if some of my response might answer Your thoughts. i think you nail it with "Well, how about communicating then...." i think that's the challenge because what we are trying to communicate doesn't have words or common context that's specially equipped to convey those wants/needs on either side of the slash. Add to that, that for many, i don't think this leaves the emotions and travels up to the frontal lobe where it's been given much thought or rationale... which seems necessary to me if we're going to try to communicate this stuff with words. Here's an example for context that uses "destroyed" as a descriptor: A Top tells me He wants to "destroy" or "wreck" my hole. i don't think most tops or Tops literally want to destroy/wreck the bottoms hole. i think the sexual spectrum comes into play, and their are some tops that literally want to destroy/wreck the thing they desire/need/crave, that if they can destroy the object of their desire/need, they can remove the opportunity for expression. i think most tops (or bottoms) who use those terms fall into a sort of in between place and "destroyed/wrecked" doesn't literally mean either. i stumble over those words whenever a top uses them with me and i have not heard the tone or attitude he has when using them. There are more neutral words that some use "stretch, open, ______," but are less... passionate, lol. And i think 'passion' is the crux of it. That the drive or our needs/wants (Top or bottom) are primal. As i see it, one attribute of a "Top" is He is hard wired to create and a bottom is hired wired to be the clay the Top uses to mold and create. i see the desire/need for a "wrecked/destroyed" hole as a expression of impregnation, creation, effecting, marking, connecting. i think those are some of the drivers and needs being fulfilled, but the heteronormative terms and situations we grew up with don't quite fit, so we have to come up with new and different ways to communicate our different needs/wants, which is further complicated by the emotional conditioning we have against those things, so our terms often end up being paradoxical. Also, our experiences, depending on the individuals involved.

"Most degrading thing "straight" guy has done to you?" my original answer wasn't really a good one for the actual question. Taken on it's own, as a simple question, for me the most degrading thing a straight guy has done to me is reject or treat me as less than because i'm gay. Rationally, i think he degrades himself more than me in that attitude/act, but emotionally, i can be devastated even by a casual acquaintance who does that. i don't think any guy ('straight' or otherwise) who ends up using me sexually qualifies as "rejecting" me. Nothings says "i need/want you" like putting your cock and seed in a person. i believe a lot of the guys who feel the need to be mean about the connection are transferring their lack of self esteem onto the guy they are using and the person they are rejecting is their self. Referring back to my original response, i have been with Men who have the need/desire to "degrade," but have an honest and affectionate acceptance of who and how They are, as well as an honest and affectionate acceptance of who and how Their recipient is. i've come to believe that the feelings of degradation and humiliation that both are experiencing are deeply embedded culturally conditioned emotions. That there's a sort of dissonance that can be experienced where need/desire is affirmed and fulfilled, even though it evokes conditioned emotions at the same time. i suspect it's not the actual degradation or humiliation that is so powerfully erotic and pleasurable, but the deep acceptance, lust and need that is being expressed for who we are, despite the conditioning against those things.

my personal desire/need for degradation took me a long time to understand. It's not generic, actually has to have certain elements for me. i do not consider myself 100% sub, rather, i have sub connecting places that some Tops have surfaced. If a guy is forceful or bulling, purposefully mean, all of those things shut me down, close me off. Depending on the guy, it can even result in a defensive reflex in me. i was with a guy at a bathhouse once who was on top of me and pinched my nipples really hard, he was instantly on the floor and me on top of him. He saw i was pissed and backed way down and we went forward in a vanilla way, He bred me. my need/desire for degradation is mixed with my Top being affectionate, but also needing/wanting to degrade me. For instance, WS can be a big connecting place in me, but it all depends on His tone. i hate role play, so if is just by rote, it doesn't work. Also, opened if He is just doing it because i want/need it. The connection of mutual need/desire has to be there. He has His cock in my mouth or ass and wants/needs to piss, there's this energy that can happen where He discerns i want/need it and it's like both our need/desire connects and feeds off each other. i've experienced this, and it's been FUCKING INCREDIBLE. He starts out a little tentative, sort of feeling me out, but when He sees He has me, He continues with a matter of fact confidence, for instance, His cock may be in my mouth and He says: "i really want to you to drink my piss from my cock." His tone and expressed desire connect to my desire to be used in that degrading way and my response encourages Him to open more, saying: "i want to use you as my toilet." Again, my heat ramps up, and He sees His power and effect on me and continues to control the situation: "you really want to be my toilet, don't you." Getting me to admit it's true. He has not made me do anything, what He has done is exposed me as someone who loves Him and His desire to use me as His toilet. THat's a culturally degrading act, but for me it is simultaneously degrading, fulfilling and affirming. That's just one example for me.

For me, it's more about the energy a Guy exudes. initial glance, i love slender guys, not all that into heavy muscle. Ironically, my current most frequent FB is a young Muscle Guy, which confirms for me that it's about the energy. He's a quiet, sweet, unassuming Guy, Who wants and needs to breed. When He fucks, His personality comes out alternating between sweetly kissing my neck and shoulders, to spanking my ass and slamming it like a jack hammer. After, He quietly asks if i liked it. Visually, if i'm at the gym, or anywhere really, slight or slender guys with a bubble butt turn my head, and yet, i'm total bottom. Shorter, younger Total Tops are a mind fuck for me, but if it's ongoing, there needs to be maturity. As for me, i've always been total bottom, and i have been 6'5" since i was 14. When i was younger, i was 160 lbs and i bordered on emaciated i was so skinny. i have a sunken chest and when i was super skinny, i really looked like i needed a meal or ten. i remember venturing out, wanting to be around some gay guys when i was 18. i went to the gay section of Venice Beach in SoCal and found some obviously gay guys and put my towel near by. i overheard them talking about me in a less than flattering way as i lay there, and it only made me more embarrassed about my skinny body. Now i weigh in just under 200lbs, still skinny, but do enough weights to have a little bit of chest and ass. i try to stay skinny because it feels more bottom to me.

"take My cock, I know you need it" Take My seed, I know you need it" Take My piss, I know you need it" Not said in a mean or forceful way, just fully knowing He is right, matter of fact.

About 10 minutes ago. my sweet Latino muscle Boy. i don't write about Him every time He breeds me, He is so spontaneous, i have to scramble to prep for Him, and have discovered just how fast i can prep lol.... sometimes it's a little scary. Haven't had any accidents, but have had a little trapped water a few times, always clean though. He's shy, doesn't say very much. We met on Squirt, so sometimes i write Him notes telling Him how much i like how He fucks and some of the ways He turns me on. He seems to like hearing that stuff, but never responds with words. Tonight He fucked like a beast, He was wild touching and scratching (not hard) my back, spanking my ass. He has a lot of stamina and i know He keeps fucking after He has cum. i'm a skinny guy. i go to the gym and do what i call my "skinny white boy routine" just to stay tone and have a firm round ass to breed, but i have no desire to have big muscles... i feel a lot more bottom being the skinny guy lol. i know, so many different flavors out there, glad some Men like my flavor, i'll take any Man who wants/needs to breed, not sure how many Tops feel the same way about bottoms, so i am always grateful when there is that mutaal desire/need. Fuck i am wet with seed, i feel so alive.

You are not A "prick." As i see it, it's only worth having if all want it, even better if all need it. i'd rather go without than have a guy fuck me who was just going through the motions and didn't want me, and me want Him. That's half the equation as far as i'm concerned. i just don't get someone who would still have sex with me knowing i don't want it. If there's a "prick" in the equation, it's the guy who would fuck you after you've repeatedly said "no."

i think you are a wonderfully intelligent and insightful person. i am impressed that, despite the awful treatment you have received by those who should love you, you have a level head and a compassionate heart. Still, these people, i believe, are poisonous evil. Personally, i think most evil is inadvertent and born out of ignorance vs being purposeful, though i think that exists too. Still, one cannot remain unaffected swimming in a sewer. i am so glad to read that you live in a country that is not unsafe for gay people. Please seriously consider getting away from these people who would harm you. WTF, your life long friend actually hit you in the face. That is horrible, he is without excuse, but a good example of how so called "friends" and acquaintances can do great evil when their fragile ideas are challenged by someone who is different. These people are less mature and more ignorant than unschooled children, they are not a healthy culture to be a part of. They are inbred and sick. i hope you leave them behind.

i know this is speculative on my part. i believe our "tastes" and predilections are from both nature and nurture. i have read some studies that suggest that nurture can become part of our genetic makeup and, thus, be passed along that way. i'm pretty confident my attraction to Men is intrinsic after trying so many years to change and still loving Men as much, if not more, than i ever did. The expressions of my attraction to Men has evolved hugely over time, but the foundation of attraction is still the same. i married when i was religious and part of the culture this thread is discussing, and have two sons. Both of them stayed religious when i came out (they were both adults when they learned i'm gay). They pretty much disowned me, though that may be changing after 16 years, and they remain very religious. They both are married and have kids, and i'm sure have made all the 'right' choices in raising their kids to ensure none of them turns out gay. Their kids are getting older, teens etc., and i am curious to see if one or more out of the six ends up being gay despite all the programing they have received to the contrary. Stay tuned.

Fuck, this makes my heart ache to read. i know, i have been there, the childhood friend as well. i even had a crush on my childhood friend. What you are experiencing and learning is what it means to be different in a world that considers it's ways to be the only right way to be and live. It is perplexing, rightfully, that those you love and want to be friends with, do not love you back. It really is central to much of what is wrong with this world, narrow, small minded people who cannot grow beyond their own sandbox. What is wrong is not you, just because you are different, but them. If you were in a position to do so, it might help if you moved, left these people behind, and started over again. Find a place where there are more gays and where gays are more accepted. It may be a hard thing to do (i did it), but in the long run, it pays off.

Fundamentalist Christianity (or any fundamentalism really, fundamentalist Islam justifies bombing and killing 'sinners' using the same exact attitude toward their bible), is not a faith based belief system, though they think they are. Instead, they treat their ideas about the bible as knowledge. They call the bible "The inerrant word of God," and "the truth," but what they are actually doing is calling their interpretation of what they read "the word of God." What they have done is elevated their own perceptions to "God" status. They do not see that it is they who have decided that the bible is the "word of God" as is their perception of "God." It's truly bizarre how they leave their self out of the equation when it comes to assigning stuff to "God." The hypocrisy of fundamentalist Christianity is endless. So many of the fundamentalist leaders today have used "God" to get rich, for instance, and there is a whole lot more in the bible about money than there is about guys having sex with each other. Even one of the most popular bible portions used against gays condemns more of the preachers using them than it does the gays they are using them against, these verses rank "greedy" right along with the gays these mega church preachers are condemning. This is from I Corinthians 6: "...you yourselves cheat and do wrong, and you do this to your brothers and sisters. 9 Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men[a] 10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God."

The good news is, it is not difficult for many, maybe even the majority? of people to "accept that someone is gay." Unfortunately, you happen to be in a culture that suffers from extreme ethnocentricity, and worse, has "God's" seal of approval. Some religions are very ethnocentric. Lot's of inbreeding and isolation helps ensure ignorance. i get it, i came out of a similar situation. i now joke: "being gay saved me from "God."" What really happened is being gay is reality for me and, though i spent a big chunk of my life trying to do what "God" wanted, and trying to be who i 'should be,' trying to be straight was a lie for me, it was dishonest and unreal. It took awhile for me to realize that it was not being gay that was wrong, but it was the fucked up ideas i'd been conditioned with by people who believe they know "God" and what "God" thinks and feels. It took me a long, long time to realize that what i thought was "God" was really just other peoples ideas about "God" that i had been conditioned to believe were "God." Sadly, these people, your 'friend,' equate their beliefs with "God," so to them, rejecting those ideas feels equal to rejecting "God." It was hard for me to escape that conditioning, and hell, i was gay and had that strong drive to help me. i figure it must be really hard for someone who does not have a strong reality i their life that goes against their ideas and condiioning, to actually get free of it. Personally, i see it as a cult, but one that has become sort of mainstream. When i accepted myself, i literally lost everything. A sizable estate that i had worked my entire life to build, went to my former ("God" believing wife). i lost all my friends because, hey, they were all part of the same belief system and they were not going to associate with a 'rebel' like me who had turned his back on "God" just so he could get fucked by Men. But the universe, or whatever it is, proved to be on my side. i don't deny the pain of rejection and loss, but i gained freedom, honesty, and peace. Ironic about the "peace," because the religion i was part of claimed that it gave "peace that surpasses understanding." i had nothing but pain, shame and guilt when i was a part of that system. Since leaving that behind, i have rebuilt and i am one happy, peaceful cocksucking faggot. Something else that can come with digging out of this landfill is understanding. i understand so much more about human nature and people in general as a result. The poison can be turned to medicine. best to you babe.

i'm re-watching the series "Looking" on HBO, and recently finished watching the more cynically titled "Uncoupled" gay series on Netflix. i confess, i have a decided romantic side to me. While i do not particularly 'long' for a romantic relationship, it is ever a lingering part of who i am. i've watched a million gay movies, lots of series with gay characters, but have never experienced anything like what is portrayed in the media in real life. Okay, i know, it's fiction... but isn't some of it trying to portray something real, or maybe an ideal? idk, just cogitating here. Couple of the things that kept slapping me while watching "Looking" last night was how spontaneous sex always is. True about all the gay movies as well. i have never seen one where you hear the scratch of the record sound and the bottom stops the heat of the moment action saying: "wait, i have to clean out." Something else i noticed in "Looking" is how they are always eating yet are always gym fit. Hell, if i think there's a possibility He may wanna breed me, i'm fasting. And there is no way i could eat like these guys. Besides the romantic tangles, the media also portrays friendships. i recently had a one year 'relationship' end. At first, it ended sadly/badly. It was tough, we really love each other, but sexually it wasn't working (for me). He has ED and i'm a total bottom, so you can prolly do the math. i wanted to continue having a friendship even though sex was out of the picture, but He is sexually attracted to me and could not have a platonic relationship, so he ended it completely. i get it, but am sad about the loss of all the other stuff we had in the relationship. i've tried to have a 'gay' social life, but it's hard to have even gay friends it seems. Most of my gay social life is online, which while i am grateful for that, seems sorta pathetic. What about all those gay dinner parties with lively interaction while feasting those gym fit bodies on unhealthy food? What are your experiences/desires/wants when it comes to gay romance and friendships? Are you getting what you want and need?

i love how you are bringing in both perspectives here. i see two distinct groups in D/s Top/bottom (which is not to say there aren't more, just for the sake of discussion here): those who get off (on both sides) on control through force, bullying, a certain level of meanness. The other is what i relate to as "affectionate control." For me, it's a lot more of a mind fuck, deeper and more of a complete connection. A top could likely force or bully me into drinking his piss, but making me do it means that he'd only have my submission in act, not my heart. When i feel affection, consideration mixed with a Mans lust/need, i become fully engaged (if we have the kink in common) and His demeanor evokes the need/desire in me to please Him. He does not create that need/desire in me, He is controlling and using something already there. For me, it is much more powerful when a Man is open, honest, real about His desires/needs. Not in a needy way, just matter of fact. If He says right up front: "i really want to use you as my toilet and have you drink my piss from my cock," He'd put me in instant heat because this stuff is essentially about us connecting and bonding at a deep and real level. His being open and real facilitates that, and He is exercising control that He may (or may not) fully realize He naturally has with me and how i am wired. Him taking His time to 'train' and help me become His good piss drinker makes it very personal vs a generic process. Him letting a little piss go while His cock is in my mouth, them affirming me when i swallow and please Him only serves to make me want to please Him more.

About 10 minutes ago, my FB i've written about here a lot. i was at the gym when He messaged me: "free rn?" i messaged back i was on my way home. i can be hairy or smooth, usually do whatever turns my Top on, i really like when He gets turned on and filled with the energy to breed by what He sees. Personally, smooth feels more bottom to me and i love Tops who get off on that, but it's not something i make a big deal about, i like to follow my Tops desires on that one. It does feel wet and slippery though, feels very sexy right now, He really creamed me a lot. He's pretty quiet, but i think He liked it because He came pretty fast, and a lot. i really love the way my hole feels right now, very sloppy, like it could take cock and seed the hole day.

For example, i f i call a guy a "pussy" or "cunt," etc., to me, that's not a a denigrating term, or "pejorative" in my mind. i like guys who are pussies and cunts, and "assholes" are not a bad thing. 😉

Have you ever found yourself cut off in traffic, or some other situation, where a pejorative comes to mind to hurl at the person, and then you pause because it's not a pejorative from a gay position? i thought it would be fun to start a thread of stuff that straights consider icky or a negative, that are hot or positives to us. Here's some of the "pejoratives" that are paradoxical to me: asshole cunt pussy fuck wad cock sucker faggot ass kisser

Biggest was 10-11 inches (i didn't have my measuring tape with me) and very girthy. We were both younger and it was at a park in Hampton Virginia. He was a hot guy as well. i was ambivalent He was so big, but of course, my lust won out. i really struggled to take Him, would prolly be a lot easier now. The smallest, probably about 2-3 inches? i've had a couple of those. One guy on several occasions, enough to call Him a fuck buddy. He was extremely shy because of His size, so i never saw Him, was always waiting naked and ass up for Him. i was always impressed that He was able to get it in because of the size, but He always did. i really grew to love Him for His desire, He always left an enormous load inside of me.

i think You've gotten some wonderful responses here. i also think hntnhole is spot on. i think some of the feelings You are experiencing are empathetic, and in a way, You are feeling what Your friend is feeling. We cannot control so many of the hard things that life brings our way, but by being empathetic, You helped him carry those feelings so he was not alone with them.

"Most patients hospitalized for monkeypox were HIV-positive in CDC report Summary by Ground News Study looked at cases of 57 U.S. patients hospitalized with severe monkeypox complications. Almost all (83%) had severely weakened immune systems, most often because of infection with the human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) Many of those patients were not being treated for the virus that causes AIDS." [think before following links] https://ground.news/article/most-patients-hospitalized-for-monkeypox-were-hiv-positive-in-cdc-report_81cad5

i don't think i've ever had an anal orgasm. From the way i've read it described, i think i'd know lol. i have ejaculated on several occasions from being fucked, but that is different from what i read as an "anal orgasm." i've bought way too many prostate massagers (they make them all way too small in my experience), and even own a fuck machine. i admit, i have a psychological block with penetrating myself, so that may be part of it. i feel like i have come close to something with some Men fucking me, but "close" may have been ejaculate or anal orgasm, and since it has not happened, idk. For me, this would be the ideal orgasm as a total bottom, both physically and psychologically.

Glory holes have always been a part of my sex life with Men, but never really transitioned from top to bottom with Men, always as a bottom. i discovered my first GH's as a young kid when i'd just go in the restroom and sit and read the wall, full of desire and need, but too afraid and repressed to act on my desires. Some of my earliest sex with Guys was under bathroom stall walls, i got bred that way a lot. GH sex has been a staple in my life right up till the pandemic hit. There's something very focused about GH sex, it's simple, uncomplicated. Usually always starts out as cock sucking, but i always offer my ass. Some take it, some do not. Then there is the middle ground where i suck, then do a quick turn around and mount th Man presenting His hard cock through the wall, and sometimes can feel the surprise of the Man on the other side. Sometimes they withdraw and let me know they only wanna be sucked, but other times i have felt a moment of hesitation when they get something they did not expect, but cannot help themselves and end up getting into the fuck. It's an almost palpable feeling to feel Him go from hesitation to full on fuck and breed.